Dealership woes...

[Casey B]

Took my ’01 job 2 to the dealer today for some warranty work. I have what appears to be a timing chain rattle in between 2500 and 3000 rpm’s. The sound that I am hearing has always been attributed to a timing chain. Dealer said it is a spark pinging and suggested that I perform a fuel injector system cleaning, decarbon top of motor then reflash the pcm, none of which is covered under Premium ESP. Approximate cost $250. I still believe it is the chain but would like to get some feedback on the issue.



Also, I had a squealing coming from the “belt” before so I changed it out (posted previously). A couple of days ago the squeal came back, only with acceleration, not on idle. Not sure what it is but after reading here I thought it was either a pulley or the alternator. They never acknowledged my thoughts about the alternator. The service rep says that it’s the idler pulley or the tension pulley. They replace the first one and said it was fixed. More on this in a minute.



I mentioned the fact that the tranny shifts funny between 2-3 when cold. I didn’t push the issue because I know that the trans fluid flush was in order with my ST having 63k. I went ahead and let them do a tranny flush for $109. They didn’t recommend the filter change at 60k. I’ll check how it shifts in the coming days. Are the Job 2’s common to have the tranny problem and is there a TSB for this. I saw the post that covered the Job 1’s but I’ve also read about a lot of others with tranny issues. Any advice?



Once all is said and done, I loaded my 1 year old in the truck and crunk it up. As soon as I hit the gas to hear how it purrs, the squealing was still there and just as bad as before. I was there for a couple of hours already so by then I was upset. Everyone went to lunch while I was paying. In a calm voice I spoke with the head service guy and had him listen from a distance as I hit the gas. He told me to shut it off and he proceeded to call me a rental. I’m waiting for a call back.



Casey B

 

[Andy Szkutak]

Damn, your trac is startin to get in the same boat as mine - tons of problems that can't be diagnosed correctly...luckily mine seems to be getin better now, and i hope this is your las problem too...all of the sport trac trannys have the dreaded 2-3 flair up during shifting...without a tuner from Wfoy, or by doing the EPC adjustment most will do that...just a common problem...Theres no tsb im aware of... my timing chain rattles too, has done it since 40k, now up to 105, doesnt bother me-actually doesnt do it for the first 2000miles after oil change, just the last 1000, but not bad and hasnt gotten worse, so im not worried...Also, my fan belt squeals like nuts until it warms up, then its fine...again, these problems are very very minor compared to most of the crap ive had, so i dont even bother with them...Theres no performance loss from either the belt or the timing chain...the 2-3 flair possibly could do damage after awhile, but it will lessen when u change fluid.



Good luck

Andy

 

[shawn stonbraker 2]

Casey, what you have with the "squeel" sounds to me like it's the belt. It could be a pulley (probably is, due to the fact you had the belt replaced). Open the hood, and rev it and see if a pulley isn't moving as fast as the rest. I have the problem with the Alternater where it has an electronic "squeel". It's not from the belt. It's from the Alternater itself.



When was the last time the tranny filter was changed? If you don't know, change it. It's not to hard to do if you have the time. You can do the EPC adjustment at the same time.

 

[troy malone]

When i had the belt squeal the dealer changed the tensioner.. haven't had a problem since..

I have the chain rattle also.. dealer did the repair under warranty at 20K-+ miles and the rattle came back about 3K miles latter.. only have 51K on my 01 now. the rattle is only noticeable when the engine is cold.. after about 15 minutes of driving it goes away.. i'd bet its the chain rattle (especially since its in the 2500-3000rmp range)and ask the dealer that if the fuel injector system cleaning, decarbon top of motor and reflash of the pcm doesn't fix the rattle if the service is free?? if they stand by their troubleshooting then they will agree...



troy

 

[Casey B]

Thanks guys for your feedback.



There's some more maintenance that needs to be done that I will do myself i.e fuel filter, rotors need turning.



stonemiser-I did change the belt myself, not too hard. Once it was off I wheeled the pulleys but didn't notice anything binding or unusual. I knew it had to be a pulley of some sort but what got me is they replaced a pulley and said it was fixed. As soon as I hit the gas well, it was not fixed.



Troy-I'm tempted to have them perform the service but that's $250+-. I'm pretty positive it's the chain that I'm hearing and I've read a couple of TSB's on the issue. I'm gonna see what they tell me when I go back.



I always reference multiple issues on these dealership visits due to the $100 deduct. They'll have to refer back if issues continue.

 

[Richard L]

If a dealer does not perform the required diagnostic test, and only wants to suggest that you get a tune-up or to have your injectors cleaned he is ripping you off. If the injectors were dirty and running lean, you would likely get a CEL and an error code. If the injector cleaning does not cure the problem (which it won't), you are still obligated to pay for it because you agreed to have it done.



Never agree to have the dealer do a tune-up or an injector cleaning. You need to tell the dealer that you want the problem solved and do not intend to pay for any unneeded parts or services that do not directly resolve the problem. That forces them to perform the proper diagnostic tests to determine what the exact problem is and forces ESP to pay if it is warranty related work.



...Rich

 

[Casey B]

Got the ST back a couple of hours ago. Turns out the water pump pulley had to be replaced. They also put a motorcraft belt on (I just changed it 2 weeks ago but hey). So I got a new tensioner pulley, idler pulley, water pump pulley and belt. Noise is gone so I'm satisfied.



I asked the rep about the service suggested and if it didn't solve the problem what's next. There were not any diagnostic tests done because I'm sure he would have mentioned it. No CEL and I didn't think that an injector cleaning would solve it.



Rich-Thanks for the input. I get the feeling that both of the dealers that I have dealt with do whatever it takes to get the vehicle out of their hands. I've saved a lot of money with the ESP but I would expect a service department to look further into issues and satisfy the customer/fix the problems.



As I mentioned I did let them do a tranny flush and after leaving today the 2nd - 3rd shift is worse. It's happening everytime and before it would only happen in the morning until it warms up, usually 5 mins. Guess I'll be dealing with this issue soon.

 

[David Torres]

Casey take a look at this link it has some interesting info about the 2-3 shift problem on our transmissions.