From another Forum..Wife and Hubby Caught...

[WXMotorSports DecalsPartsAccs]

LOL keep your mind out of the gutter...



Portland, OR Traffic Lawyer recommendation?

So one of my employee's comes in the other day complaining about some traffic enforcement van parked alongside the road. He thought he saw a flash and didn't know what to make of it since he was doing 35 in a 35. The next day he was irritated enough and flipped it off!



Well...I guess they put the van at the end of a 20mph school zone and get this, the school is shutting down! They put the van at the end of the 20mph zone on the last two days of the school's existence! Further, this is on a five lane (two each way + a center I believe).



Apparently his wife got nabbed once as well so in the period of three days...three tickets. He would like to get a recommendation of any traffic lawyers in the Portland area if someone knows of one. Thanks,



My response-

I'm confused...



Posted speed limit is 20 MPH in school zone when children are present (WA). Or posted 20 MPH all the time during school days and hours? I can't tell from your post.



One is traveling 35 MPH, 15 over the posted limit, and gets a ticket in a school zone.



My 2 cents...

Doesn't matter if it's the last two days of the school year or the last two days of the schools existence. And, doesn't matter if the unit is at the end of the school zone because it's reading how fast one is going IN the school zone.



After the first ticket I would of told my wife to go the speed limit in the area because there is a radar unit. Getting two tickets in 3 days...well I would bash my head on the wall (smiley face)



Are we guilty?

 

[Tom Schindler]

Well, depends on the state codes. Nester Traffic Systems was on contract with the city of Akron collecting money for the city's general fund. People were getting hit with $250.00 for going 35 in a 20 MPH zone. Unfortunatly, the speed limit in that area at that time was 35 MPH. The tickets were given out 30 minutes AFTER school started and 30 minutes BEFORE school let out. Clearly Nester was not playing fairly. It took many complaints and one lawyer to file a charge against the City and Nester to change the operations to comply with the law.



FWIW, I am against city "ATM machines".



By law, that guy can be guilty. What was the exact time the ticket was issued? What exactly does the law say? Are flashing lights required? If so, were they flashing?



So many unanswered questions can dispute the legality of the tickets.



If an officewr was there to write the tickets, those people would have had the opportunity to discuss it with the officer and know what they did, or if they are actually guilty of any wrong doing, and lear a lesson before tickets 2 and 3 happened.



Ultimatly, those automated ticket systems are for revenue generation and not about public safety.





Tom

 

[WXMotorSports DecalsPartsAccs]

Tom - good points. He replied to my post and said his employee speed up near the end of the school zone. Then uses the analogy just like when you see a posted speed change sign you speed up.



He indeed was doing 35 in a school zone 20 MPH. In WA it's 20 MPH when kids are present which means the length of the school day. I always see bike cops at the local school down the street all different times during the school day. Not sure in OR as he didn't answer the question to OR laws.

 

[Tom Schindler]

In ohio, it is 20 MPH when kids are visable. Afterall, what is the difference when kids are in a building at school or in their home?



So, the Ohio code says...



"Whenever children are going to school, from school, or whenever children are present"



So during a fire drill, you must slow down.



The city has announced that even thoug, by law, flshing lights are not required, they WILL NOT issue citations as a school zone UNLESS the lights are flashing.



So if you are driving 45 MPH in a actual School Zone, but the lights are not flashing, you will only be issued a citation, provided 45 MPH is faster than the posted limit. If the lights are flashing, then you would be busted for 25 over the limit in a school zone.



Nester still get busted issueing tickets at times when it is not a school zone, and as long as you do not challenge it, you are making a donation to Nester traffic systems for acting like Police Officers without actually being sworn in.





Tom

 

[CountyMounty]

Well my overall thought is if there is no dispute that they were going 35 in the 20mph school zone then the tickets are completely justified and there is nothing to fight. This is of course assuming the law was in effect during that time period. It should not matter how the violator was caught, whether it be an enforcement van, a motorcycle cop, patrol car, monkey with a radar or whatever. I certainly agree that having a visible patrol officer as opposed to an traffic enforcement van or system is a better option but it still does not negate the fact that they were violating the speed limit. While certainly the set up does garnish a lot of extra fine money for the state/county/municipality but the purpose of the law is not to make money it is to get people to drive slow and cautious in the school zone.



Just FYI the laws here in my state are that all school zones are 15mph "when children are present". The school zones must be marked with signage (but not necessarily flashing lights). Some schools put specific hours on their signs but it is not required. Generally it is an hour time frame in the morning and an hour in the afternoon when the kids are coming and going (these are generally the schools that sit well off the road and the main concern is the traffic coming and going at peak times). Bascially as Tom stated if there are any kids out and about the law is in effect. When I get a request or a chance to work a school zone my rule of thumb is if there is a lot of traffic/ buses coming or going from the school and/or if there are any children visible in the vicinity the law applies. Also since our fine amounts continue to grow and grow every year I mostly write tickets as a normal ticket and not a school zone, meaning if they are going 35 in a normal 25mph they get a ticket for 10 over and not for the 20 mph over in the school zone. This is a difference in fines of about $200. My hope I guess is that the ~$150 fine will serve the same purpose as the ~$350 fine.



Everyone remeber to drive slow in the school zones.