Bought a new car (non-ford)

[Thomas Rogers]

Derek says:

Man, it seems like if I support Ford I am the bad guy or something, cant I just like Ford and not really care about Toyota without getting a lecture? I dont remember things being like this when it was Ford vs. GM vs. Chrysler.

I hope I didn't make you feel that way.



I just implore you not to think negatively of the consumer, as they and the sellers define the market. If we look at the market, we often want to say things like "stupid consumers, why aren't they buying this?", when the simple reality is they would be buying "that" if they perceived/see that its the better valuable or more desireable product....and value and desireability are the responsibility of the sellers to define.



TJR

 

[Travis Munday]

I'm simply trying to find a viable reasoning.



"Domestics" imports are legit, but domestic "imports" aren't.



Sometimes we have to think micro and not macro.

 

[Dallas Starr]

who care if you buy import or domestic as long as your happy. really do you think by buying 1 domestic vehicle your making a difference (like there is even one to make). I love how as soon as someone buys something that isnt ford that people get on his case... whether it be by what he bought or a comment someone makes. IMO no one really makes a bad line out there. Sometimes factories will release a lemon, thats why there are wrranties and lemon clauses... this is also why i will never buy a job 1 of any vehicle.



Personally I think chrysler is releasing some great vehicles as of late, I not not a huge fan of the looks of the caliber but thats my opinion and Im not going to debate it with anyone else. I cant wait to try out one of those news challenger or even the new camaro.



Does this mean im getting rid of my ST.... only for another ST, it just fit my lifestyle perfectly and I have no reason to change.



Congrats on the new purchase!



Dallas

 

[Derek Hale]

TJR, no you did not really make me feel this way, I got what you were saying, and you are right. I have fallen into that "WHY WONT YOU JUST BUY THE FORD?!" thing a lot.



But it usually isnt because I just want them to buy a Ford, I happen to just really like a lot of what Ford makes, like the Fusion. We have one, and I LOVE that car. It drives so nice, has a solid and reliable feel to it, and a super nice interior. But then it seems like it gets no love anywhere else, even though the few reviews I have read on it are great.



So I get a little frustrated when it seems like you are not allowed to be a "cheerleader" for any company other than a foreign company anymore, even if its based on experience. After all, changing a companies image to others is usually done best by people talking to their friends, not just by company advertising.











As for the import/domestic where the car is made debate, I just really dont care anymore. Its a never-ending argument that is totally dependent on the vehicle and really nothing else. What you should care about is determining where a majority of the money from your purchase ends up.



I love reading "well the factory is in the US, etc etc etc etc" but they dont seem to get it that the people at the factory are a minor minor part of the overall profit distribution.



One small example:



Here at Federal-Mogul, there are parts sheets for cars hanging up whenever we get to be the supplier for new vehicles. Its like a cut-away of the car, and it shows who is supplying just about every part for the car, its really interesting stuff.



Generally, you look at a Ford, GM, and so on car, you see the company is based in the United States. There are a good number of import parts, but most of the actual components come from the U.S.



These part sheets generally show the part breakdown for 30-60% of the cars major parts.



Now when you look at a Honda or Toyota vehicle, which there is actually a Lexus one up now, 90% of the companies shown as suppliers are from Japan. The exception generally being the tire manufacturer, the seals/spark plugs (which is where FM usually comes in) and maybe a few other things.



Then add that to the end profit which goes to Ford who pays a higher number of employees in this country than Toyota or Honda do I am sure. Then add that to Ford and GM spending money on domestic based R&D firms, while Toyota usually uses local Japanese R&D firms.



There is more to a company that factories people!

 

[Derek Hale]

Oh yeah I would also like to say:



I did not make this thread for debating. I made it because I wanted to talk about a new car I bought, and wanted to give my little review about a vehicle from a competing company.



This was not started, and says nowhere, that I would like to discuss anybody's views on the global economy. I am really tired of debating everything lately, especially cars. I just wanted to throw the new car thing out there and maybe if someone wanted to give some links to cool Dodge sites or something, then sweet. Or if you want to talk about the car, or debate the Caliber itself, then I can do that! I have read a ton about this thing and driven it for close to a week now, almost 500 miles already.



If you want a debate, please make your own thread, I may even come in if its interesting, but please un-jack my thread for now.



Thanks all!

 

[Travis Munday]

Derek,

With all do respect, when you say things like "At least I did not go import, I am still far from losing those brain cells.", you've opened the door to a debate.



And as you said, you have to take the whole "import" "domestic" thing car by car. You cite what cars you've seen, but does that make all Toyota's and GM's the same as the few that you've seen? Did you know that the Honda Ridgeline has 75% American parts content while an Avalanche has only 61%? Or that a Chrysler 300 (built in Canada) has 72% American parts content, while a Camry (built in Kentucky) has 80%? So where is the money going then? Where are American car companies investing their (marginal) profits? Certinaly not in America. In fact, they are closing plants while Asians are opening plants. Look at China and India, that's where a lot of money is going, from American companies, German, and Japanese.

 

[Deleted deleted]

Thanks Tiger, you took the words out of my mouth.



Derek: if you didn't want a debate, don't diss other folks choices, or question their intelligence for making a different buying decision than yourself.

 

[shawn stonbraker 2]

Derek, I've been following this thread and gotta say, congrats on the new vehicle. As for the "debate", good god guys. All he wanted to do was post on here about a new vehicle he got and let us know about a vehicle that just came out. Who cares if he said something about not buying an import. I'm sure everyone has put opinions on here that not everyone has agreed with. Hell, I put one on an eirlier post that you took offence to tiger. As stated before "OPINION". That's what I love about this site. i don't have any friends with a ST so I come here to discuss things and I sometimes post my opinion and some won't agree with it. remember the Superbowl tirade that went on after it was over? I was in that one also. After awhile I got tierd of it and just moved on. Derek asked to let this post die and now we are still dragging it on. So, Derek, congrats and hope you like the car and it's good to you. No matter where the hell the parts came from. I think my jockie shorts are from China. Who cares, they keep my package in place and are comfortable. Lets all lighten up.

 

[Derek Hale]

Haha Stonemiser, I liked your closing line, thats pretty classic, and thanks.



Darin, I am sorry bud, but you are in no place to talk. The number of times I have seen you go on about your Toyota whenever someone says that they are having a problem with their truck is too numerous to count. You have on several occasions bashed Ford and praised Toyota, which in my book is "dissing" other peoples choices, whether it worked out for the best or not, thats what it is.



I explained what I meant by my brain cells statement, I cant make it any clearer, and the reason had nothing to do with where parts came from.



Please re-read my reason for the statement and stop pretending I said anything else in relation to the original statement.



Vis a vi.



Concordently.



Ergo.



I feel like I have to walk on eggshells with you people. As stonemiser said, lighten up.

 

[Derek Hale]

Oh yeah, on a more cheerful note, if anyone has any suggestions for good 6x9 speakers to replace the stock Dodge ones, that would be much appreciated.



It does not matter if they are foreign or domestic or where their final build location is.

 

[Travis Munday]

Replace them with a good 6.5" plate style. Although with it being a lease, mounting a tweeter may not be of use. I've got the polk/momo 6.5 with the integrated tweeter...the depth may be too much though.

 

[shawn stonbraker 2]

Derek, I have been partial to Kicker brand. I put 6x8's in my ST and absolutely love them. The base is great and the mids and high's are just that. Very well sounding to my ear at any level of play. Of course if you want better bass then you could do like tiger said and go with a couple of 6.5" plate style. (maybe in rear doors or the hatch)

 

[Derek Hale]

Thanks guys.



Dodge has a spot in the hatch area where the put the sub if you get it from the factory. Since I did not get one, they leave it as an open storage space with an easy to remove door cover. It seems to provide a good amount of space though, and has holes for mounting.



Check out the pics I took here to see what I mean.



http://www.flickr.com/photos/vulnox/sets/72057594088430942/



Thanks again for the advice on speakers. I have a friend who has done a ton of speaker work. He did one heck of a job on his car, which I believe is a Hyundai hatchback, dont know the name. He has done stuff for a few other people I know too, and has offered to take on my car as his spring project.



When I signed the lease I asked what I could do to the car, they said anything I wanted as long as it adds value and does not take it away.



They advised me that leopard print seats would probably fall under taking away from value.



Damn.

 

[shawn stonbraker 2]

Then I guess you'll have to figure something else to do with the Leopard print jockies you have then.:lol:

 

[Tom Schindler]

So, Derek, you must agree that Hyndai is no longer an "import". This company has invested millions into state-of-the-art design and production facilities; designing and making 'American' cars....in America.



Then, you must also agree that cars such at the Ford Focus are "imports". This car was designed in Europe for the European market. It is built in Mexico (with a secondary plant in America, but still using Mexican made drivetrain).



So long as the profits stay here in America...oh wait...they aren't.

I wonder where the Worldwide headquarters of Ford Motor Company ang General Motors is at? Japan, Korea, Europe? Someone please help me out here. I just don't know.



Where is the world Headquarters of Honda or Toyota at?



How about Hyundai? It must be in America because they spent building a center in the USA. That would mean the HQ is in America.



Sorry. That isn't the case. Corporate Hyundai is in Korea. Honda and Toyota is in Japan.



I just don't know where the GM and Ford HQ is.





Tom



Oh wait. I think Ford is in Dearborn, MI and I think I did see a giant GM building in downtown Detroit. Yup. The profits from a Ford go to other countries while the profits from Honda, Toyota, and Hyundai stay in America.

 

[Nelson Atwell]

While it is true that Kia and Hyundai are Korean companies, Daewoo is completely owned by GM, and therefore must be an American company, even though none of the asembly is done by Americans. You will find their cars driving in your city sporting a new Chevy Aveo badge.



[Broken External Image]:

Daewoo Matiz

Chevy Aveo

 

[gary s]

best of luck with your new vehicle ! it looks like it is alot of fun to drive. as far as the domestic versus import i have expressed my opinon many times.

i'm not here for that ( today at least ), once again best of luck

 

[Mark Grumpy]

I want to know more about the tranny.



Personally, I'm waiting on a Dodge too - Challenger.



How is the overall fit and finish on the Caliber? Does it compare to other Dodges??



grump

 

[Derek Hale]

I dont know much about other Dodge's except my dad had a 2004 Hemi Ram and now has a Stratus, but I have only been in the Stratus once.



Out of the three I believe this has the best fit and finish though. I do not like that it has has much hard plastic as it does, there is almost no cushion for your elbows. But its a minor complaint and has not caused me any major discomfort. Still seems bad to have left out.



I am happy to tell you whatever you want about the tranny. I have done a lot of reading on it lately and now have over 500 miles on it driving, so I am pretty confident I can answer anything you may have as long as you dont want super technical specifics on it, I only know so much on the components of it.



It was made by the same Japanese company that makes Nissan's CVT's, but its a more advanced version than anything offered on the Nissans. It has the auto-stick feature which is new, and is supposed to improve the Caliber's mileage 8% above a standard 4-speed auto.



Thats some basic info, ask away if you want anything else.