E-Bay

[Jacob Dryer]

200 rms would be an educated guess

 

[shawn stonbraker 2]

That's about what I was guessing. Thanks Jacob.

 

[Tom Schindler]

You also didn't have them holding your feedback hostage till you posted you feedback for them either. They would post it as soon as they had your money (the way it should be since you took care of your side of the transaction,

Theresa has missed out on hundreds of feedbacks by people, much the same as this website, where they have no problem accepting the feedback, but aren't willing to "repay" you. Many sellers are tired of that. As a seller, your feedback is your resume. The higher the feedback, the better.



So instead of dealing with those that want you to give it, you hold yours back and let them post first. My favorite are those that like to post neutral feedback and simply say "good transaction".





Tom

 

[Nelson Atwell]

I've bought and sold a few items on EBay and never had any problems.



I think the whole buyer's feedback rating is stupid. I can understand wanting to rate the sellers, since they are usually businesses that people have never heard of. It is a great way to weed out dishonest sellers. However, if the buyer is paying up front with Paypal or Visa/MC who cares what his rating is? He either has the money or not.

 

[Fudged Undies]

Stone, have you tried <a href="http://www.cardomain.com/shoptype/Subwoofers"target=top>CarDomain.com</a> yet. They often have stuff on clearence, prices are pretty good even when they aren't. They usually list the specs with the product. There's plenty to choose from and it is really unlikely you will suffer the ebay bs.



I also agree with Big D about indoaudio. I've bought from them with good results.

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Feedback hostage is WRONG. Period....BAD feedback comments, not HIGH feedback is an indication of a sellers true nature.



The higher the volume of feedback, the bigger the power sellers, the more likely they are "hiding under the radar" several hundred neutral and negative feedbacks a year or month.



That's why I use tools like the following to get a Power Seller's "real" story....

 

[WXMotorSports DecalsPartsAccs]

JT#14-I'm one of those sellers that only leaves feedback when I get positive feedback. Why? 90% of my negative feedback is from buyers that thought they were getting a real replacement Ford emblem. Every auction I have says decals at least 5 times and it also states in red "These decals are NOT replacement Ford Emblems. So, yes they did there part by paying quickly but because they can't read an auction ad correctly I get negative feedback.



But I have to say my best Negative Feedback was from some moron that bought the item at 10:58PM Friday night and left me Negative Feedback because he didn't receive it yet. He left the feedback the following morning...LOL freakin moron!!!

 

[Tom Schindler]

Theresa got a negative because someone asked to get thier item by the end of the week. It was wednesday. They sent a personal check and she got it saturday. The check was written on friday.



Sorry, I do not consider making the buyer leave feedback first as Feedback hostage. Theresa has over 3000 positive feedbacks with 99.7% positive. She is also a power seller and averages about $2,000 per month in sales. During the last quarter of the year, she will do up to $4,000 in sales each month.



She does her job very efficient and she is very fair.



She does not like those buyers that do not understand how feedback works. Most buyers could care less about thier feedback. I can't tell you how many buyers have 3 and 4 negatives in a row and don't care. As a seller, negative feedback is a no-no and Theresa does her job well. She makes sure the items are packaged up properly, shipped out when promised, and represents the items lists as truthful as possible. She does not deserve negative feedback by some imbisil that can't read.



What part of "If sending a personal check, you must wait 10 days for check to clear my bank" don't you understand?



How about, "Insurance required"? Is that hard to understand?



I can't tell you how many emails day she gets with people asking, "Can I skip the insurance if I bid on an item?". Ummm...sorry. Insurance is required.



If there were not so many stupid people on ebay, it would be a better place to shop.





Tom

 

[Fudged Undies]

Sorry Caymen and SST, just by logical order feedback SHOULD be left by the seller first. I agree there are plenty of crappy buyers out there and much of the negatives I see are very often left by ebayers with less than 20 buys. This obviously says something about newbies to ebay and peoples ignorance to read anything completely in general. (I've seen similar going on on this board with the four letter words. Regardless of whether they offend me or not, they are no-no's on this board but some folks use them anyhow and I'd be willing to bet they didn't read the rules of the board, at least not that part). But when I win an auction, 99.9% of the time I pay within an hour of winning (yeah, that's just me not everyone). At this point my job dealing with the buyer is over and my feedback from the buyer should be based off of that.



The feedback left by the seller, I would think, should be based on the transaction @ the POS. Many sellers want payment within 48hours. If I meet their criteria, I have earned my positive feedback. Sellers always have the ability to reply to/defend a negative. The only neg I have was over an item I won for a dollar. The seller was out of canada and didn't respond to email. I got his number and called after two or three months. I advised him I considered the sale null due to his non-responsiveness and would not post feedback assuming he didn't either. He left me a negative, and amazingly enough his other negs were similar to the neg I left him.



Since feedback is part of the ebay system for judging your seller/buyer some judgement has to be used in reading it. In the case of SST, checking his current auctions along with the feedback left should give anyone buying sufficient confidence to do business with him. The people it would scare away is probably a good thing and will avoid newbie premature feedback as in Theresa's situation or newbie ignorant feedback as in SST's.

 

[WXMotorSports DecalsPartsAccs]

Good feedback SS

 

[Fudged Undies]

SWEET!!!

 

[shawn stonbraker 2]

I have to agree with Spaceman on this one. When I pay (usually using Paypal right after I "buy it now" or get the notification that I won the item) my part is done. As SS stated, the seller has an option to respond to the feedback left. I don't buy much on E-Bay (only 25 feedbacks and a few of them were from selling items) and have yet to leave anything but good feedback. That is even after having to hassle with some sellers. I will usually post something along the lines as "Item was as described but needs better comunication", if I had trouble getting in touch with the seller. (the only time I do that is when there is a delay in getting the item and I'm talking over a week of waiting) I know not all buyers are like that but I always read the feedback of the seller. If I don't like what I am hearing about the seller, I go elsewhere. If the seller has a remark to the neg. feedback that makes me feel that he was wronged for getting it, then I will deal with them. (most of the time that is how it is) Last night while looking for a sub, I read this one guys feedback that constantly said he was rude and really smart mouthed when he was asked to fix a problem with the sale. He got back on there and posted a response calling most of them "morons" and saying stuff like "learn to read and then come back and buy on E-bay". He really had a smart-a**ed comment for every neg or Neutral feedback. I went elsewhere, needless to say.

 

[Tom Schindler]

You are right that your "part" of the sale is completed, Spaceman, and feedback should be left. I also feel that as a buyer you should leave feedback. Many, many, many buyers NEVER leave feedback. Since they choose not to leave feedback, why should she? IMO, and hers, the sale is not complete until the feedback has been posted.



Like you, when I win the auction, I pay as soon as I can. if the shipping is listed I pay it as soon as the auction is over. When I receive the item, I post feedback.



Just because you are given the opportunity to reply to the feedback, your negative feedback will still count towards your overall score. Only under extreme circumstances will you get the feedback mutually withdrawn, but it then shows that the feedback was withdrawn.



Lets say that Theresa sells something on ebay. One example was a box of Crayola Crayons. I don't remember the actual size, but we got them cheap and they were brand new. The same crayons are being sold at K-Mart, Wal-mart, etc for over double what it sold for. Low and behold the buyer claims that they are dollar store crayons. Give me a break. Crayola is Crayola. If the box says Crayola...and they are made by Crayola...and the same thing sell at Wal-mart, what is the problem? They gave her a negative feedback for that. What can she do? Say They are not dollar store crayons? She is still stuck with the negative feedback while they got positive feedback.



Sorry...homie don't play dat. That persons feedback was something like "shipped exact item listed in auction. Crayola is Crayola."



Selling on eBay is not easy. Stupid people are everywhere. SST knows what I am talking about. The auction says they are overlays and people think they are the actual emblem. They get pissed off at you for them not reading the auction. He deserves negative feedback from someone that doesn't read before they buy? I can not agree with that.



I challenge anyone here to work your butt off selling stuff on ebay, average $1,000.00 in sales for three consecutive months to get "Power Seller" status and deal with 20 to 30 emails a day from the dumbest people on earth asking an even dumber question.



"I know the auction says 'Kit is complete', but is there anything missing?"



My favorite was selling a power moonroof. A buy-it-now for $399.00 with a best offer option. She got 10 emails a day with people offering her $100.00 with free shipping. Took the best offer option down and changed the price to $395.00 and it sold in two days. Were were happy and even threw in free shipping with insurance. The moonroof was worth $1,000.00. The box got damaged and a piece was bent. That buyer filed a claim for $600.00 with Fed-EX for a part that could be replaced for $30.00. We even offered that buyer to pay for return shipping of the bent one and we would send them a new one. Nope...wasn't good enough for him. I guess he forgot that when the shipper insures it, the shipper gets the money. Theresa got involved and explained the situation. They sent the check for the $30.00 for the replacement part and they refunded the original shipping costs. That buyer had the nerve to think he should get the shipping refunded back to him. I paid for shipping and because we offered free shipping as a "good will gesture", we kept it because we paid for it.



I could go on, but some people are set in their mindset that waiting to post feedback is a bad thing, so why bother.



Until you have dealt with selling thousands of dollars of goods a month, you will not understand what it is like.





Tom

 

[Mike Wilson]

There are days that I thank my Higher Power (GOD) that I have never had the

pleasure, or discourse, of ever having sold or purchased anything on E-bay.

This day would be one of them!!!

Did you all ever think that you would EVER meet someone who has never either

purchased or sold an item on E-bay!!!

I am an E-bay Virgin!!!



(Autographs available upon Request)!:lol:

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Caymen says:

Sorry, I do not consider making the buyer leave feedback first as Feedback hostage

Sorry, Caymen, but what you "consider" isn't the issue. The definition of the "feedback hostage" slang term is when the buyer states and has the practice of ONLY returning feedback when feedback is given. That's the definition. That's where the term comes from, so what you consider isn't the issue.



What makes this problem even worse, is that many sellers that practice this also NEG the buyer if the buyer NEGs them first. This is vendictive or retaliatory feedback, and its wrong as well. I use www.toolhaus.org, and I won't buy from a seller that practices retaliatory feedback.



TJR

 

[Tom Schindler]

I checked out www.toolhaus.org and I can't see that it does anything special that you can't do using ebay.





Tom

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Many power sellers sell hundreds if not thousands of products a month. Weeding through all their feeback to see the negs can take hours, and who has the time. Toolhaus gives a report of just the negs and neutrals, and those often speak volumes about a power seller.



TJR

 

[Fudged Undies]

Tom, I understand your position on what Theresa goes through, and I can sympathize, however, it changes nothing and is unfortunately part of running an ebay business. I've had a couple of sellers hold back FB and contacted them about why I had not been left FB upon completing my side of the deal. They stated that since they sell soooooooooooooooooooooooo much, they reply once a week or so to those that have left them FB. I replied that I would not leave FB unless they did first, and their response was pretty much "who cares" since they sell soooooooooooooooooooooooo much they didn't see the a reason to respond first. That's unfortunate, as I will not buy from them again. Yeah, I'm not going to make them rich or poor, but I can pretty much guarantee they won't have any headaches from me assuming the auction is accurate.



Any seller that does this to me, I will make sure that I note it in the FB. If you leave FB for the someone and they don't leave it for you, that's part of the game. Where is my guarantee that the seller is going to leave me FB once I leave it for them? There is none. Just because they've sold a billion items means nothing. The fact of the matter is a buyer HAS to trust the seller just to make the purchase and therefore the seller SHOULD trust the buyer. Perhaps forcing folks with less than 50 FB's to leave it first wouldn't be unreasonable, but many sellers won't sell to folks with negs or few FB's. Like it or not, it's the sellers responsibility to leave FB first and chances are the buyer will learn the ropes as they become more familiar with ebay. Besides is no FB worse than negative FB?

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Hey, Matthew McConaughey's 1971 Corvette Stingray Convertible brought $61,600 and it all goes to charity. Nice. See the link below.



Regarding the feedback hostage thing, yes, I see Caymen's POV about stupid people and people that leave negative feedback unjustly. But, I think that's going to happen regardless, and if you really think you are going to keep that from happening by requiring buyers give feedback first, then you won't. Sure, you can then ding them back, but the negative has already been applied to the power seller account, and the counter-ding looks like retaliatory feedback which also hurts the seller. And, don't think that neg'ing a small buyer will hurt their rating and affect them in the long run. Obviously if they give unjust negative feedback, their account won't last long as most sellers won't sell to them and they will just open another account. You can't change their stripes. The good news...there aren't THAT many boneheads out there, and if one truly is a legit, good-willed power seller there aren't enough of them to put a dent in the feedback rating.



By having sellers hold feedback hostage what it is saying to the buyer is:

- You go first, but BE NICE!

- Shipping was slow...Too F'ing Bad, I have the last word!

- Packing was sloppy...Too F'ing Bad, I have the last word!

- Product wasn't exactly as expected/described...Too F'ing Bad, I have the last word!



What ends up happening with the current system in which most power sellers hold feedback is that the feedback from the buyers is really not meaningful as it is overly nice. Other's can't trust it. People HAVE to be nice. That's why I:



a. Look at ALL the neg and neutral feedback a seller gets using toolhaus.



b. Look at as much recent auction feedback as possible, noting auction end-date (especially if ending with Buy-It-Now), and then the feedback date...the time in between is typically the shipping time. I see if that is reasonable.



What I tend to find by doing the above is that there are MANY, MANY power sellers out there that are abusing the system. They are selling items they don't have, shipping items after several weeks to a month after purchase once they fill their JIT inventry, and for the most part, they are running their business on loans floated by buyers. And, the current convention of feedback hostage allows them to get away with it and keep relatively high feedback ratings because the buyers simply have to bend over and take it.



Sure, there will always be boneheads. The buyer is sending money for something that is "sight unseen", often sold "as-is", and that requires a leap of faith and quite a bit of trust. Once the payment is received and the item shipped, the buyer has done their part and seller should now trust the buyer and give them feedback. Then, the resultant feedback from the buyer, if any, will be legit and meaningful, sans the few crackpots here and there that would be crackpots regardless the orchestration.



Caymen, why not have Theresa try, for just one month, sending her feedback to buyers upon receipt of payment. See what happens. I bet it won't make a difference to her business and her feedback. And, if that proves to be the case, it is a practice that she can advertise in her auctions and that will drive MORE business (I know I would buy from more sellers knowing I have the final say).



TJR