help from thoes in law enforcement, PLEASE

[Mike Dziubina]

thank you guys soooooooooooooooooooo much, this is great. keep it comming...thank you all for your comments

jt#14...thats great i didnt even think of that...thats freakin awesome man..i will plan on it if i get the ticket..

to clarify more i am starting another post and i drew up a picutre the best i could to illustrate what hapened

 

[Mike Dziubina]

hhaha oh god you guys are awesome i didnt see the last 3 posts b.c i was writing the one i just wrote..thank you guys this is great.



i jsut started another post w. a picture be sure to check it out...thanks in advance again

 

[Jo Wainwright]

My daughter got a letter in the mail that a bus driver had taken down her plate because she had gone around him when the flashers were on. She said they were not on when she went around.



I told her if she was sure, to go to court and let them decide. They only thing that saved her was that the bus driver did not show up. Judge told her that if the bus driver was there, they always side with the bus driver. He was very snotty to her, too.



Jo

 

[NYJohn]

I really can't get enough of this topic. It seems to really be split. After reading the post from Jo Wainwright, I have to wonder what kind of justice system we have in this country. The Judge strait out admits that they always side with the driver? Why have a court date then? It's hard for me to digest this because most of the bus drivers where I live aren't fit to drive a bicycle nevermind a school bus and allowing them to have this type of power is mind boggling to me. At least once a week there's an incident on the news about a school bus driver either leaving kids on the bus, or having a criminal history, or crashing the bus and having drugs or alcohol in their system.

 

[TomT]

I seriously doubt if you will ever see a ticket. But if you do, demand a trial by jury. When your trial date comes up, tell the judge you have not yet found an affordable attorney. This will prolong everything and end up making the bus driver make multiple trips to the courthouse (without him as the prosecutions witness, they have no case). I can almost guarantee he will end up not showing up.

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Here is some advice to everyone...never pass a parked or slowing school bus, that way you never have to get into a pissing contest with a bus driver as to whether or not their lights were on.



That's the way I drive....rounded a corner JUST the other day, turning left. A house was on the corner on a small lot, and I couldn't really see that far down the road I was turning on-to. As I made the turn, BAM, there was a school bus loading kids with it's lights on.



I STOPPED DEAD...and the car that was following too close behind me got "stuck" in the intersection and started blowing his horn. I put on my hazards, tried to wave him to be calm (the friendly wave, not the one-finger salute).



Once we started back up, I think he saw the bus, because I saw him wave kindly back to me.



It happens. They are HUGE, they are BRIGHT ORANGE...don't pass them.



TJR

 

[Tom Schindler]

Here is some advice to everyone...never pass a parked or slowing school bus, that way you never have to get into a pissing contest with a bus driver as to whether or not their lights were on.

Uforunatly, the law does not support your advice, therefore it holds no weight. Just because a bus is stopped does not mean I must stop too. What if the bus has a flat tire? Must I sit behind him blocking traffic while he fixes the flat? What is the bus is full of kids coming home from school?



From what I read here, here is what I think happened. The Bus driver forgot to turn his lights on. When someone appeared to go around him, he got pissed. He won't admit his lights were not on because he would be in the wrong and could loose his job for it.





Tom

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Caymen, you are in some mood today.



No, if a bus is stopped with a flat tire you don't have to stop AND stay there while they fix it. But if a bus is stopped in the middle of a lane (not off to the shoulder) on a main road, and one is coming from the other direction, it is a VERY GOOD IDEA to slow to almost a stop and be prepared to stop as you approach, and if going that slow, stopping at the last minute as the lights come on, or as you assess what is going on is not an issue.



So, maybe the bus driver didn't have his lights on in this case.



My son's elementary school has a bus loading zone and the entrance into the school runs parallel to it. The buses DO NOT put their lights on when loading and parents are ENCOURAGED to drive around the buses because it is behind the school that parents do their pickups.



Frankly, I can't understand in this situation WHY the driver would have their lights on and WHY (unless clearly marked otherwise) there would be any issue with driving by the parked/loading buses.



I think THAT is the issue here...what IS the expected traffic pattern of the school grounds when the buses are loading?



BTW, NJ has a pretty good description of their law in this area (see link below) and it seems clear to me that they (NJ) don't indicate ANY requirement that the bus lights be on when stopping (only that they go off before proceeding), and they also discuss the differences between pickup/dropoff road-side and the (un)loading in a school zone when the main school load runs parallel (and in this case motorists are allowed to pass, but at no more than 10mph).



Check the local/state laws for CT.



TJR

 

[Tom Schindler]

So, maybe the bus driver didn't have his lights on in this case.

In other words, the bus driver was not doing his or her job the way it should be done. If I do not have a stop sign, there is no reason to stop because of the fear tht someone coming the other direction might not. I do not have a stop sign and there is no reason I should have to stop. Mind you, if I see someone driving too fast that they might run the stop sign, I am going to stop for my safety. Even if the other driver runs the sign and hits me, he is still at fault and will get the traffic citation for breaking the law.



You pretty much contridicted your original post with your last post. Being on the road and a school parking lot are two different things and should not be compared.





Tom

 

[Thomas Rogers]

You are right, being on a road and in a school parking lot ARE two different things, and I tried to clear that up (so as NOT to contradict myself) in my second post.



So, I will ask again, WHAT IS the law in CT for passing a school bus loading/unloading in front of a school?



I did some more research, the GENERAL statue from which all US states and Canada pull for this law is UVC 11-705 (see link below); and additional US-CT law states the following:

Stopping for school bus

US-CT Connecticut Connecticut General Statutes ¡ì14-279(a)

In addition to UVC 11-705(a), a vehicle operator must stop ¡Ý 10 feet (3 m) from a school bus flashing red lights on any highway or private road or in any parking area or on any school property, except at the specific direction of a traffic officer. At the intersection of ¡Ý 2 highways vehicular turns toward a school bus getting on or off passengers are prohibited.



Flashing red lamps on school bus

¡ì14-277 Flashing red lights and the stop semaphore must be used to get on or off passengers.



Stops exempted

¡ì14-279(a) Same as UVC 11-705(c) less exemption in a loading zone on a controlled-access highway.



Penalties for illegally passing stopped school bus with fines in the United States dollars (USD)

¡ì14-279(b) Fine 100 ~ 500; ¡Ý 2nd offense: fine 500 ~ 1000 and/or imprison ¡Ü P30D Regulations of Connecticut State Agencies ¡ì14-137a-5(d)(3) 4 points

So, the question still remains, DOES CT (and the local school) consider the stop "exempt" given that in this case it seems to have occurred in a "loading zone"? I wouldn't call the school parking lot a "controlled-access highway" as described by UVC 11-705(c).



Isn't law great?



It does seem clear, however, that CT DOES require that the red lights be on in order to semaphore (signal) the stop and loading. Some states don't require this and leave the question as to whether or not the bus is stopped in order to load children seemingly up to the driver to determine.



TJR