RAID (hard disks)

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Chris Kulbaba

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Hey all, since everyone here seems to know everything I thought I would shoot some of my networking woes this way ;)



Anyways, I talked my boss into going full fledged server at work. I know quite a bit about PC's but not really in the server aspect...



The system that we are going to use for the server currently has a 150GB raptor drive for the OS and a 500GB Seagate drive as a slave drive. To do a raid config (please let me know which is best for securing data, I beleive I read RAID 1) anyways... do ALL the drives have to be part of the RAID array, or can I leave the 150GB Raptor drive as the OS drive and just raid the 500GB w/ another one that I get?



Thanks all!



 
What OS are you using and what roles / applications will it be serving?



also, how many users will hit this server?
 
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Yes, you will be best protected if everything (OS and data) is contained on the RAID 1 array. However, to accomplish that, you will need an array controller and drives, typically you'll have an easier time if all the drives in the array are the same size and type. You create the array, and then install your OS.
 
We will be running MS SBS 2003 R2. Which I need to know how many CAL Licences I will need... I just have no idea about this portion of the game ;)



There will be about 10 users. (Including people and computers/printers)



The drives are identical 500GB Seagate Barracuda SATA Drives w/ 16MB Cache



There is actually NO RAID controller on this motherboard, so I need advice on a card...



Chris



 
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If you already have the SATA drives, use them. If you don't and can afford SCSI, get SCSI (or Serial Attached SCSI).

In the commercial server world, SATA drives are made to run 5 days a week, 9 hours a day and have a 1 year warranty figured on that duty cycle. SCSI drives are made to spin 24x7, and have a 3 year warranty. They are much more durable.

If your business needs permit it, I would shut down that server at the end of the day, and bring it back up in the morning. Your SATA drives will last much longer that way.
 
Let me just list the system components, so no one is in the dark ;)



Intel Dual Core 2.66 Ghz CPU

ASUS P5K Motherboard

2 * 500 GB Seagate Barracuda Hard Disks w/ 16MB Cache

4GB Corsair PC2-6400 800MHz Ram (4x1



and I think the rest is irrelevant....



 
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You can create a software RAID1 in Windows 2003 under disk management. You will need 1CAL for ever workstation accessing the server (10) I think SBS may come with 5 CALs, you will need to verify that.



Create a 50GB C: partition during setup so that you will account for patches and software updates. Use another chunk as D:, etc...



Each partition can be set up as RAID1 using the 2 - 500GB disks. (Raid1 50GB, raid1 250gb, raid1 200GB). The last partition you create will be in the slowest area of the disk, so save that for low utilized apps.



If you intend to get into exchange, SQL, active directory etc... you're going to need a better box and you will want to upgrade to hardware raid. For this I suggest buying from an OEM like dell or HP so that you can take advantage of hardware support and built in hardware diagnostics and utilities. You will also need to think harder about RAID configurations at that point for performance, as well as redundancy.



Also, even with the RAID1, invest in a backup software, or at least a 1TB external USB2.0 hard drive. You can schedule the native Windows NTBackup to back everything up nightly.



In the server world, disk failure is only 1 of your problems. You have the right idea going to a server for the business, but in order to make it show a return you'll need to take advantage of everything a server platform brings.



If you were just looking to do file storage, get a NAS snap server from adaptec.
 
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You can do RAID two ways: hardware, or software.



If hardware, you need a RAID controller card, or your motherboard needs to have one on it.



If software, then your OS needs to support it (any server OS you are going to run these days does).



If it were me, I would NOT put everything on the RAID partition. This is because if the drives crash, you won't be able to boot and will need to boot from a CD or other rescue disk. If one of the RAID drives goes bad and you have your OS on the smaller internal drive by itself, you can keep operating and the server stays up.



It is trivial to reinstall an OS, even Windows. If I were setting this up, I would put the OS on the single internal drive with no protection. I would set up RAID-1 on two 500GB drives, though I'd probably set up multiple RAID-1 partitions (like 2x250 or even 4x125) instead of one giant one.



There are any number of ways to do it on a small budget...but doing it "right" would require a lot more money and a lot more hardware (RAID-5 instead of RAID-1, for example, or even RAID-1 using two RAID-5 arrays). For our servers at work, we do not put the OS on a RAID partition because we use snapshot images...restoring the OS onto a server takes less than an hour and we can spend the money on protecting our data instead of protecting our OS.



I agree with the others...I would get a 1TB USB (or firewire) drive and use it for backups.







 
If it were me, I would NOT put everything on the RAID partition. This is because if the drives crash, you won't be able to boot and will need to boot from a CD or other rescue disk. If one of the RAID drives goes bad and you have your OS on the smaller internal drive by itself, you can keep operating and the server stays up.



Negative, 2003 server will automatically boot from the mirrored drive.



It is trivial to reinstall an OS, even Windows. If I were setting this up, I would put the OS on the single internal drive with no protection. I would set up RAID-1 on two 500GB drives, though I'd probably set up multiple RAID-1 partitions (like 2x250 or even 4x125) instead of one giant one.



Negative, re-install is fine until you decide to install applications / active directory, and then you need to recover the OS as it was when it crashed. It is usually best to try and recover.
 
Go with a hardware RAID and mirror the two drives 500GB drives. Create a couple partitions in the mirrored array - one for the OS and another for the data. With your low user count, you probably won't have any trouble running all that SBS has to offer on that hardware. Depending on what's going on, you might feel some performance issues with Exchange and SQL once in a while, but I doubt it will be anything that's going to disrupt your office given what you had previously used.



With the hardware raid, if one of the drives fails, your system should still run fine. Replace the drive and tell the RAID card to rebuild on the new drive. That way you don't have to mess with reinstalling the OS or any of your applications.



In my opinion, that'll give you the least hassle if a hard drive should fail.
 
Nobleman said: "Negative, 2003 server will automatically boot from the mirrored drive."



True, assuming both drives are good. "Tastes great, less filling", I guess...I never put an OS onto a RAID partition. Then again, I don't deal with small single-server setups so maybe it makes sense for them.





 
In his configuration, 2003 should boot off the mirror from a failed primary, without an nt boot disk. He is not using separate controllers and has like hardware, but of course he should test that before going into production with it, and with 2003 at the latest service pack and patch release. I'm like 99% sure, but I've seen many computers behave exactly the opposite of what they are supposed to do. You may even need to physically remove the failed disk (unplug) before the OS will boot.



Even if the failover is not automatic, it is not that difficult to create an NT boot disk. It is worth the chance the mirror is viable, and repair is a 10 minute operation rather than a re-install and re-config, especially when taking advantage of all SBS features. Worst case, you move the sata cable to the port the dead primary was on, then plug a new drive in after hours and re-establish the mirror.



Parts should be replaced with exact matches, so if you can, keep an extra set of parts or two. This is where you benefit from using OEM hardware and support for future replacements when Best Buy has discontinued selling an item. I prefer HP.



I guess...I never put an OS onto a RAID partition. Then again, I don't deal with small single-server setups so maybe it makes sense for them.



I'm not getting into a who has more servers match. If you're not putting your OS on RAID, you just enjoy dropping your pants for a game of whack-a-ball. To recommend a business run without fault-tolerance is irresponsible.



Business is business and money is money. You build a server, you plan for its brilliance and its failure. Everyone is right that your business might get along fine when the server is down, but you're going to hear it all day "the server is down", and if you're lucky, you'll get to hear about it for a while longer until it happens again. That is if you were able to recover it.



ALWAYS err on the side of recovery and put in place reasonable measures to ensure continuity. Don't forget to backup the backup files on the usb drive to a tape, put the tape in a fire-heat-water-proof safe, etc...



It's not about the computer, it's about business. Of course there is only so much you can do within reason, but be able to say you did something when your boss asks you to fix it.



Oh and check www.microsoft.com for all the articles you can stand to read and research your work. 99% of Windows related answers are there. Don't take the advice of Sport Trac fanatics when your job is on the line.



But to answer your original question, RAID 1 is fine.

 
Nobleman said: "I'm not getting into a who has more servers match. If you're not putting your OS on RAID, you just enjoy dropping your pants for a game of whack-a-ball. To recommend a business run without fault-tolerance is irresponsible."



No, we don't. I won't get into a who has more servers match, either, but suffice it to say that I'm an infrastructure team leader for a large company with datacenters on all continents except Antarctica.

We have LOTS of servers. ;)



Fault tolerance has many, many definitions, and the key word in the phrase is "tolerance", not "fault". Assess the risk...when you scale up to where I spend my days, there are so many redundant systems and processes in place that the hard cost of having the OS on a RAID partition is outweighed by the cost savings and admin headache (soft costs) of managing it.



We don't even use CD-ROMs for our servers, or recovery disks, or anything like that. The admin overhead of managing those things, keeping track of who has them, where they are, whether we have all of them, which ones go for which servers, etc is a monster headache.



In our case, since every server for a given purpose is identical, we can snapshot the OS image and in the case of a failure, just install a brand new one, getting us right back to the start, much quicker than running a vendor's recovery process. We also don't need to worry about the recovery process failing to work for some reason...we KNOW our snapshots are good. In general, the OS remains static, data always changes. After a certain point, going to great lengths to protect something that doesn't change ends up costing more than it adds value. We spend our money and effort protecting the data.



Like I said, "tastes great, less filling". For small server setups, OS on a RAID might be a good idea. We just don't do it, but we're not a small setup.





 
In our case, since every server for a given purpose is identical, we can snapshot the OS image and in the case of a failure, just install a brand new one, getting us right back to the start, much quicker than running a vendor's recovery process.



Good for you, you have lots of servers and tunnel vision to boot. Since they all have the same purpose, you are supervising the (same exact basic server) x (LOTS). You left out that you are running some form of VM or OS image type solution. Bravo, you're doing what everyone who has the funds in the industry is doing, real star trek type stuff there spotlight.



If you have a snapshot of the OS, you are placing it back in the same state that it was when it crashed. That is not a new re-install and you have a solution to mitigate the loss. That is very different from suggesting someone run with no raid or fault tolerance. Even still, from my perspective, preventing the outage from ever happening is better than having to re-image even in 15 minutes. But I'm sure your company did the ROI for that extra hard drive x(LOTS).



We spend our money and effort protecting the data.



Agreed, for some systems the data is crucial. You suffer from typical IT guy tunnel vision, for some systems uptime is crucial. Your business has established an SLA that you are protected by. XST's SLA will be "the server is down".



Fault tolerance has many, many definitions, and the key word in the phrase is "tolerance", not "fault". Assess the risk...when you scale up to where I spend my days, there are so many redundant systems and processes in place that the hard cost of having the OS on a RAID partition is outweighed by the cost savings and admin headache (soft costs) of managing it.



I'm already scaled up and I still managed to assess XST's risk. 2 disks, why would he not mirror the OS? I know how to do things in a small business solution because in a large enterprise, sometimes you need to consider cost and reality. Sometimes you're not in a data center. Don't trivialize someone's business because it is a small setup, and if you're not comfortable advising on a small setup, don't give bad advice. That's why IT has such a bad rep to begin with.

If you want to show off your tech savvy, don't do it while offering a consultation. "Fault tolerant" means that the solution can stand up to reasonable failure, you're implying "acceptable loss" which means "we tried, but $h!t happens and that server can be down for x amount of time." That's determined on a box by box basis.



Or offer your solution to XST, advise on a snapshot solution the space required to hold that snapshot, a backup solution for the data, the required connectivity and licensing, and the amount of recovery time (15-45 minutes?) on failure.



I'd rather he take advantage of RAID1 since he will mirror the data partitions, why not mirror the OS partition? The 0 minutes of downtime because the server more than likely stayed online, XST finding the dead drive and scheduling 20 minutes after hours to replace the drive and let it rebuild in the background, his boss learning that he saved them from a major outage, he looks like a hero, builds cred, applies cred toward his next recommendation.



I know, I know, when you have all those LOTS of servers, it's hard to hear Joanne in accounting yelling "Oh fu$k, the fu$king server is down again."
 
John -



I apologize if there are some incomplete thoughts below, I just typed it out quick before heading off to a family Christmas gathering without really proof reading.



It sounds like you have the resources to do the imaging and the luxury of having identical systems or some sort of virtual configuration such as VMWare. So, in your case, re-imaging the OS is probably your most cost effective method of handling the issue. You probably also have those machines in some sort of failover or cluster configuration so you either don't suffer from or have very little down time.



In most small businesses they don't have the resources to be able to set up a cluster or be able to keep an image of every system. You are fortunate enough to have several of the same hardware configuration which makes your option more viable.



I know of several small businesses where they don't have any IT staff and suffered something as simple as a hard drive failure. They ordered a new hard drive with overnight delivery. They are in a rural area, so not exactly high on the delivery driver's list and it doesn't get delivered until the next day. So, now they've been down for two days. Since they don't have any IT staff, they track down the high school kid down the street to reinstall their OS after school. Now, they've been down for 3 days. High school kid gets the OS installed but doesn't know anything about the databases or other applications they use. Their software vendors (probably 2 or 3 different vendors) step in and try to restore the most recent tape backup but discover the tape is bad so they go back to a few days older tape and were able to recover data. Now, down 4 days and lost 3 days of data. Spend the 5th day rekeying data and trying to get things caught up. Whereas mirroring a single hard drive (with the OS) would have probably saved the week.



Yes, there are several things that could have done to make this less painful. But without dedicated IT staff, chances are it won't be done. Even with a IT guy or two on staff, chances are it would have still been pretty painful.



However in a small business, single server environment, the name of the game is to take affordable steps to mitigate the problem until replacement parts can be acquired and installed. So, it makes sense to put the OS on a RAID partition to keep the system up. They don't need the licenses for the imaging software or the storage space to keep those images which means less hardware to implement and maintain as well.



In many small businesses, running a frugal, yet effective IT system can be the difference between their 20 employees receiving a raise/bonus or not that year.



XST - Don't forget that you need some sort of backup system to protect your data in case Murphy strikes again. It's possible that you could lose both hard drives, your building burns, the roof leaks, UPS battery explodes, thieves break in and steal your server, etc. Preferably some sort of backup method that can be taken offsite (tapes) or transferred electronically. There are many companies that securely transfer backups via the internet to an offsite location for a pretty reasonable price - First Backup and Mozy come to mind.



Anyway, have a Merry Christmas and enjoy the time with your families! :)
 
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