A Nation of Sheeple

[Nelson Atwell]

It is really like any entity. When you are at the top of the food chain, survival isn't threatened, and you lose focus on the goal of survival. You spend your time doing things that don't have anything to do with survival. Gradually, the entity goes into decline, because resources are wasted on fruitless pursuits. Hopefully, some threat will come along to help refocus the entity onto fruitful goals, before it is killed/conquered by a stronger entity.



This happens in humans (we become prosperous, then lazy, then fat), countries (Rome became prosperous, then decadent, then fell), and of course there are Lions (which sleep about 20 hours a day).

 

[Tom Schindler]

Insurance companies are one of the companies to blame. They strong arm businesses to get rid of smokers. The dictate if a company can allow smoking on the premises. They don't directly say "Stop it now!!!" they say, "If you eliminate smokers from your workforce, we will lower your premiums". With rising health care costs, a company has no choice to ban smoking. When the ban doesn't cut the costs enough, they make a policy to not hire smokers. The really sad part is it is legal. You can not discriminate for race, religon, creed, sex, or disability. You can discriminate for alcohol use (unless you pull the disability card), smoking, or any other "habits" that are considered "bad".





Tom

 

[Mike Wilson]

When I was a child I caught a fleeting glimpse,

Out of the corner of my eye.

I turned to look but it was gone.

I cannot put my finger on it now.

The child is grown, the dream is gone.

I have become comfortably numb.



We all know where these words came from, and it scares me now to think

that it may have become a self-fulfilling prophecy.:unsure:

 

[TrainTrac]

Yup, the gov't is sure doing a much better job with airport screening and security than the private sector. Here's another fine example:

Security screener at JFK Airport charged with stealing $80,000 from checked bag



October 20, 2005, 8:15 PM EDT



NEW YORK -- A security employee at John F. Kennedy International Airport was charged Thursday with stealing $80,000 in cash from a checked suitcase headed for Pakistan, the Queens district attorney's office said.



The Transportation Security Administration screener, Frank Ulerio, Jr., 23, allegedly stole the money when he was inspecting checked luggage on Oct. 7 in a Pakistan International Airlines area at the airport. Prosecutors said he stole the cash from the suitcase of a 45-year-old passenger from Astoria, Queens who was flying to Pakistan.



The victim discovered the theft when he landed in Pakistan and police from the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, which operates the airport, began an investigation.



When confronted, Ulerio admitted stealing $60,000 and said he used some of it to pay off a gambling debt. Police recovered $18,000 when he was arrested at work Wednesday.



Ulerio, a Queens resident, faces charges of grand larceny and criminal possession of stolen property. If convicted, he faces up to 15 years in prison.



Ulerio is awaiting arraignment and will have a court-appointed lawyer, said Kevin Ryan, a spokesman for the Queens district attorney's office.



The owner of the money did not declare the cash but Ryan said he was never asked if he had anything to declare and likely will not be charged with a crime.





Copyright 2005 Newsday Inc.

 

[Rich Stern]

I'm sure the guy carrying $80,000 in undeclared funds to Pakistan was obn his way to do charity work.



Caymen, the people who run insurance companies have a responsibility to their shareholders to run their companies profitably. If insuring smokers is a losing proposition, they have to develop ways to eliminate smokers as customers by either a) getting their customers to stop smoking, or b) making them expensive to insure. I have no problem with insurance companies not providing charity services for people who voluntarily do medically expensive damage to their bodies.

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Are you a smoker Caymen, or just a civil rights advocate?

 

[Tom Schindler]

TJR, From my first posting on this thread above.

That is exactly what someone once told me. I don't smoke. If they banned smoking tomorrow, I wouldn't care. I don't smoke, and frankly don't care to. At the same time, I respect the right that you should have a choice to smoke or not to smoke.

Rich Stern, I know exactly where you are coming from. Theresa worked for an insurance company. I just don't feel that the insurance companies have a right to dictate to a company who they can hire. I do feel the insurance companies can test someones blood for nicotine and charge accordingly.



Andy H...

Yup, the gov't is sure doing a much better job with airport screening and security than the private sector

Last I heard, there have not been any planes flying into buildings lately. Greed is greed. It doesn't matter if you work for McDonalds, IBM, or the IRS. Some people, given the opportunity, will steal. It could be anything from a Chicken McNuggett to $1 million dollars.



I do feel the new rules banning you from locking your suitcases while traveling is BS and should not be allowed.





Tom

 

[Dre L]

I have no problem with insurance companies not providing charity services for people who voluntarily do medically expensive damage to their bodies.

Okay, but why not alcohol? Why just smoking?



Both are hazerdous, but they are legal.



I do have a problem with insurance companies charging people differently based on statistics and risk. By doing so, they discriminate, against age, and other factors, including demographics. It's not about streamlining risk and charging accordingly because a computer says so. It is stereotyping. If I did the same thing ins. companies did, I'd be charged with discrimination. A cop would be charged with profiling.

 

[Tom Schindler]

nobleman,

Okay, but why not alcohol? Why just smoking?

Because that is the first step. Once they "win" that battle, it will be alcohol. Then they will find something else. Do you like to race cars at the race track? OK, there is a risk. Cancel those people. Like Amusement Parks? Another risk. Like to go boating? They could sink. Another risk. I can go on and on.





Tom

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Noble, insurance companies discriminate based on statistics that cause those in higher risk groups to pay higher premiums....that's what they do; that's what they have always done.



Consider life insurance...should a 25yo male pay the same for $1000 in Term Life insurance as a 76yo male?



TJR

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Caymen, I feel that it comes down to responsibility.



You seem to not want to have smokers be responsible for their choices. It is the choice of the smoker to smoke, and it has been proven that there is no amount of smoking that is not dangerous (unlike alcohol usage). The choices that smokers make are likely to result in increased medical costs in the future vs non-smokers.



So, to have smokers pay more for insurance, or to have a company that doesn't try to curb smoking by employees pay more seems "fair" to me, and according to making people responsible for their choices.



What are the alternatives? Should we simply make everyone pay more, equally, to cover the poor choices of others?



BTW, I understand many people have smoked for decades starting back when the dangers were not as clear as they are today. I tend to give them a little bit of a pass, but only to a certain degree. I am a heavy guy and am otherwise healthy, but because of my weight, I pay more in life insurance than a fit person my age. Again, that's my choice.



TJR