NYC Stop and Frisk...I did not know
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How can NYC's Stop and Frisk be legal?? And just what constitutes Suspicious behavior. I think the actions of the Police are far more suspicious than those of the people they stop.
This happened in 2011, and nothing appears to have been done to stop these illegal searches on the street and the police's belligerent attitude towards the citizens they are hired to protect.
If the Police Officers are so angry that they are being forced to conduct these illegal searches, I'm sure they would find a way to stop it.
...Rich
This happened in 2011, and nothing appears to have been done to stop these illegal searches on the street and the police's belligerent attitude towards the citizens they are hired to protect.
If the Police Officers are so angry that they are being forced to conduct these illegal searches, I'm sure they would find a way to stop it.
...Rich
Oldtimer
Active Member
Welcome to the USSA.
Richard McAlister
Well-Known Member
People who dress to look suspicious are suspicious. Know why wall street people never get frisked? Because they don't look like the are about to mug someone.
Kevin Lang
Well-Known Member
For crying out loud: if you're not in the military, you're a civilian. Cops are civilians. I think this elitist "cops vs 'civilians'" nonsense is part of the problem. :banghead:
Tom Selleck's Blue Bloods dedicated its most recent episode to this issue. Sort of.
Sadly, it isn't a stretch for me to believe this. The days where cops were like Joe Friday are long gone, if they ever existed. That said, I'm suspicious of this. If the Stop-and-Frisk is as common and heinous as this video alleges then why haven't they recorded video of an actual encounter?
Tom Selleck's Blue Bloods dedicated its most recent episode to this issue. Sort of.
Sadly, it isn't a stretch for me to believe this. The days where cops were like Joe Friday are long gone, if they ever existed. That said, I'm suspicious of this. If the Stop-and-Frisk is as common and heinous as this video alleges then why haven't they recorded video of an actual encounter?
EddieS'04
In Memoriam 1950-2022
I have fairly bushy beard. In the winter I wear alot of sweats. Summer shorts and t-shirts. I dont own a suit. I live in an old nieghborhood.
So in your opinion I look like a mugger...and should be 250'd....
I also dont own any patten leather shoes. My pastor still let's me in the Church.
BTW, you should meet my pastor he dont wear suits either and rides Harleys....
I never judge people by the book cover.........
Bob McDonald
Well-Known Member
No, not racist. Stereotyping, yes, but not racist.
rmcalis,
So, just what constitutes "Dressing to look Suspicious"? What makes a person "Suspicious"? Is it the clothes, their age, they don't appear to fit in that neighborhood, or that they keep looking back at the cops who are obviously following them? Stopping a person "Acting" suspicious or fitting the description of a suspect and asking them ID is one thing, but claiming the person looks suspicious because of how they dress, then frisking, and arm twisting are pushing it way too far.
Cops that do that are only looking for any resistance or excuse to arrest the guy or even worse.
When I was a teenager, growing up in the Cleveland, Ohio area, we were constantly being stopped by the cops to check ID's and they always wanted to search the vehicle...but never said why? I really thought that kind of police harassment had ended by now?
...Rich
So, just what constitutes "Dressing to look Suspicious"? What makes a person "Suspicious"? Is it the clothes, their age, they don't appear to fit in that neighborhood, or that they keep looking back at the cops who are obviously following them? Stopping a person "Acting" suspicious or fitting the description of a suspect and asking them ID is one thing, but claiming the person looks suspicious because of how they dress, then frisking, and arm twisting are pushing it way too far.
Cops that do that are only looking for any resistance or excuse to arrest the guy or even worse.
When I was a teenager, growing up in the Cleveland, Ohio area, we were constantly being stopped by the cops to check ID's and they always wanted to search the vehicle...but never said why? I really thought that kind of police harassment had ended by now?
...Rich
Robert Thomas
Well-Known Member
Terry vs Ohio
Richard McAlister
Well-Known Member
Why racist? Peoples of many colors and ethnic groups work on wall street.
I think the race card is getting worn pretty thin.
Stereotyping, yes. I think that was my point.
Kevin Lang
Well-Known Member
Is this sarcasm?
If a person doesn't want to be considered a miscreant then they shouldn't style themselves as a miscreant. Despite what LL Cool J tried to say, when someone idolizes thugs enough to want to emulate their dress it isn't illogical to think that that someone might want to emulate thugs in deed.
People consider other people to be police officers based on their uniform-which is why we have laws against impersonation of a police officer-so why is it so radical to think that someone wearing a "thug life" getup is actually living the thug life?
This goes regardless of race IMO.
If a person doesn't want to be considered a miscreant then they shouldn't style themselves as a miscreant. Despite what LL Cool J tried to say, when someone idolizes thugs enough to want to emulate their dress it isn't illogical to think that that someone might want to emulate thugs in deed.
People consider other people to be police officers based on their uniform-which is why we have laws against impersonation of a police officer-so why is it so radical to think that someone wearing a "thug life" getup is actually living the thug life?
This goes regardless of race IMO.
Bo Loo
Well-Known Member
And they steal millions with little to no repurcussions.
Steal a six pack? Hello jail.
Steal millions? Here's your fine (maybe).
Kevin Lang
Well-Known Member
If we went after people who stole on Wall Street and similar crimes (ie:real estate) then we'd have our problems solved as virtually every person in the US Government who is running the country into the ground would be in jail. Martha Stewart should have done her time alongside hillary clinton & "dingy" harry reid, both of whom should be in there for life.
"Anyone who gets rich in politics is a crook" <-Poorest US President to-date (Harry S. Truman)
...why shouldn't stealing a six pack land you in jail? If we make exceptions for street thugs like "it was just a six pack, no one got hurt" then what would the equivalent be for white-collar crimes? "It was just a hundred grand, no one got hurt"?
"Anyone who gets rich in politics is a crook" <-Poorest US President to-date (Harry S. Truman)
...why shouldn't stealing a six pack land you in jail? If we make exceptions for street thugs like "it was just a six pack, no one got hurt" then what would the equivalent be for white-collar crimes? "It was just a hundred grand, no one got hurt"?
If I wear a hoodie, and I do, I'm emulating a thug? That's news to me. I guess the fact that I have a concealed weapon under it really seals my thug life.
Wu Tang 4 life!
By the way, I've never been stopped and frisked while walking while suspicious and I've never been to Wall St.
Wu Tang 4 life!
By the way, I've never been stopped and frisked while walking while suspicious and I've never been to Wall St.
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Kevin Lang
Well-Known Member
I don't agree that wearing a hoodie instantly makes a person instantly look like a thug. We both know it takes more than that.
Protip: if you wanna live the Thug Life, that heat you're carrying under your hoodie has to be illegally purchased* and not held in a holster; if you don't have it jammed down the front of your pants, you're doin' it wrong. Lessons learned from living in the proximity of B'more for years :bwahaha:
Protip: if you wanna live the Thug Life, that heat you're carrying under your hoodie has to be illegally purchased* and not held in a holster; if you don't have it jammed down the front of your pants, you're doin' it wrong. Lessons learned from living in the proximity of B'more for years :bwahaha:
Not one NY'er posting here but you are all experts on what happens in my city.
I would say that the video is definitely one sided. I am not saying the kid did something wrong by wearing a hoodie but in some areas of the city there is an alarming high amount of people carrying weapons. If you want to portray yourself as a "gangster," gang member or thug then be prepared to be treated like one. In a day and age of kids bringing rifles to school and shooting up the place or an emotionally disturbed person bringing high powered weapons into a mall and killing people maybe checking to see if someone has a gun isnt such a bad idea.
The cops in the video definitely went to far and didn't conduct themselves correctly.
I am sure this will bring an onslaught of opinions and rants and all that. I won't be responding.
I have worked in the streets of NYC for a long time. I have seen things that didn't have to happen.
Merry Christmas to all
I would say that the video is definitely one sided. I am not saying the kid did something wrong by wearing a hoodie but in some areas of the city there is an alarming high amount of people carrying weapons. If you want to portray yourself as a "gangster," gang member or thug then be prepared to be treated like one. In a day and age of kids bringing rifles to school and shooting up the place or an emotionally disturbed person bringing high powered weapons into a mall and killing people maybe checking to see if someone has a gun isnt such a bad idea.
The cops in the video definitely went to far and didn't conduct themselves correctly.
I am sure this will bring an onslaught of opinions and rants and all that. I won't be responding.
I have worked in the streets of NYC for a long time. I have seen things that didn't have to happen.
Merry Christmas to all
JohnnyB, that's weak. I don't think the shooters in your sensational circumstances would have met the "suspicious look" criteria used by the NY stop and frisk program. I don't think your city is so unique that nobody else can possibly form an opinion, either.
But, as long as the Constitution doesn't matter... Stop and frisk is just too subjective and leaves too much discretion to a public administrator to decide who looks suspicious. I have to wonder, is there police training on how to determine what a suspicious person looks like? I'd be interested to see that training.
BTW, I use public administrator for emphasis. With the utmost respect for those police truly serving and protecting with their oath of office in mind, I disagree with the expanded powers of public administrators that gives a high school graduate a gun, military training and turned loose on the public streets to look for suspicious people rather than respond to emergency situations where the facts are known.
Redfish, Terry v. Ohio is one of the cases I believe the Supreme Court got wrong.
I think it's clear what a suspicious black person looks like. If unsure, ask NY police.
But...,
What does a suspicious white person look like?
What does a suspicious Latino look like?
What does a suspicious Asian look like?
Remember, they're stereotypes, and by some accounts on here, that's completely different and okay and not racist. So, just so I can avoid looking suspicious and getting unconstitutionally detained and groped by a public administrator on a power trip, please answer those questions. I seriously want to see answers to this.
But, as long as the Constitution doesn't matter... Stop and frisk is just too subjective and leaves too much discretion to a public administrator to decide who looks suspicious. I have to wonder, is there police training on how to determine what a suspicious person looks like? I'd be interested to see that training.
BTW, I use public administrator for emphasis. With the utmost respect for those police truly serving and protecting with their oath of office in mind, I disagree with the expanded powers of public administrators that gives a high school graduate a gun, military training and turned loose on the public streets to look for suspicious people rather than respond to emergency situations where the facts are known.
Redfish, Terry v. Ohio is one of the cases I believe the Supreme Court got wrong.
I think it's clear what a suspicious black person looks like. If unsure, ask NY police.
But...,
What does a suspicious white person look like?
What does a suspicious Latino look like?
What does a suspicious Asian look like?
Remember, they're stereotypes, and by some accounts on here, that's completely different and okay and not racist. So, just so I can avoid looking suspicious and getting unconstitutionally detained and groped by a public administrator on a power trip, please answer those questions. I seriously want to see answers to this.
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