Tire Cupping problem, burnt by Ford warranty

[Doyle Ptak]

Guys you are going to have to excuse me on this one if I go off the deep end, I am just so mad at the Ford warranty people I could scream. I got tired of listening to the tire noise on my trac (05 XLT LIMITED 13,000 MILES) and noticed that the tires were wearing really bad on the insides of both front tires. I had just read your post from a cpouple of nights ago on the TSB 5-11-11 on the same issue. Armed with this info I called my Ford dealer and set up a time to take the trac in. I talked with the service manager and he looked up the TSB and said that sounded like the problem. I get a call this afternoon from the service manager telling me the front end did need to be re-alingned and the two tires replaced. Then he proceeds to tell me that since it is out of the 12 month 12000 mile warranty period that the best that Ford could do for me is give me a 50% discount on the cost of the repairs (360,00) so I am liable for the 180.00. I argued the point of the TSB to no availe. At that point I ask who I need to take this up with at Ford, and was given a 1-800 ford number for arbitration. Long story short I went through the song and dance again and was told that even though I had taken the trac in before the 12/12000 period and comp[lained about the noisey tires that was different than a wear problem. I was put on hold while he called the service manager. About 10 minutes later he returned and told me that the 50% discount was all that Ford would do and that it was very generous of them to to that. I asked for his mqanager and was told, now get this, " Ford had made a descision and it was final, there is no one else that I could talk to about this issue."

If you think I am not pissed guess again, I have never been treated so rudely by a car company in my life. I was kicking around the idea of buying the extended warranty, but why they would screw me on that service too. In case you are wondering I was never rude with any of them, but did purdue my complaint in a matter of fact way, I am a purchasing manager by day and know how to keep my cool when I am burning uop on the inside.



This is my first new Ford, I have owned bowties for years and have never had a problem with a warranty issue, and was never told that I needed to pay 50% of the cost when a vehicle was under the 3/36000 waranty period for anything. Could this be my last Ford product, somehow I get the feeling that this relationship will only go downhill from here.



Thanks for listening!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am on here lurking about every night but seldom get into making a post or a reply.

 

[Tom Schindler]

An alignment from a reputable show will not cost anywhere near that price. Rotate the front tires to the back and go on with life.



I had the Wrangler RT/S tires and had problems with abnormal wear on the front tires. Got rid of those tires and the problem went away.





Tom

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Caymen,



The cost quoted ($360, owner liable for 1/2) seemed to be for the alignment and cost of two replacement tires, and that seems like a reasonable price.



The moral of the story...get your issues addressed SOONER, not LATER. If taken in just a month or two earlier, they probably would have covered the whole thing.



TJR

 

[Mike Wilson]

Dptak,

Exact same thing, only completely opposite!

I traded in my '02 Chevy Silverado for my 'Trac, after I heard the Chevy Service Manager

mumble (supposedely, so he thought, under his breath!) that I must be stupid, for

requesting the "Secret Service Warranty", on my Silverado's "Steering Column Shake/

Shudder Under Low Speed Turns/Parking Lot Manuevers" issue!

Sounds a lot like one of the issues that we have with our 'Trac's, doesn't it! (Pump Issue?).

As many of us have said here, before, and will say again:

The Dealer can "Make or Break' a sale, or a return/faithful customer.

Sloan Ford, in Columbia, TN, has always dealt respectfully with me on my issues, and yes I have

had several, for my 'Trac!

P.S. The Goodyear tire do Suck!, and badly! Forgive my English!

Go with a B.F. Goodrich or a Michelin, on your next tire purchase!

 

[Richard L]

I agree with TJR. If the alignment and tire wear were so bad at 13K miles, it was showing obvios signs or a problem long before you took the vehicle in. And Ford is correct...You complained earlier about noisy tires not abnormal wear. The Goodyear Wrangler RT/S is an alweather tread and not known for the smoothest, quietest ride.



Had you brought your vehicle in prior to 12K miles complaining of abnormal tire wear, then you would have a right to complain that they did not correct the alignment problem during the warranty period. I suspect that you probably never rotated your tires in those 13K miles.



Sorry that it didn't work out for you but Ford has not violated any part of their warranty.

You may want to do as Caymen suggests. Move the front tires to the rear and have the front end aligned. You will still get some road noise and perhaps a bit of a vibration but it will keep you going until you decide to getting new tires.



...Rich

 

[Bill Ellis]

This is a clear case of reading the warranties and understanding them. If the period is 12,000 miles/12 months, then waiting until 13 months is too late and soley the fault of the buyer. Warranty also clearly states that tires are not covered by Ford, but by the tire manufacturer only for defects in workmanship. Now anybody who has been reading the posts on this site for any length of time also should know that the stock shocks often lead to tire cupping and that they need to be replaced. The blame here is not with the dealer nor Ford, but with the owner. I think that a 50% discount is more than generous. If it were me, I'd be really happy to get that kind of deal.

 

[Thomas Rogers]

However, let's not forget the frustration with which Dptak speaks, and the reality which is that this particular problem IS one that is all too common for Explorers (not just STs), and one that seemingly any dealer should be familiar with.



I haven't met a dealer service org yet that doesn't seemingly "play dumb" (maybe it's not an act) and make the customer go through the motion of describing problems, sometimes again and again, and the dealer doing little "half fixes" (e.g. "let's rotate the tires more frequently, yeah, that's the ticket"); all the while if you talk to a service tech and not a service manager you get the real story, and that is that they "see your problem 'all the time'!"



So, yes, by the "letter of the warranty" Ford and the dealer did okay here. But by all reasonable estimations, Ford and dealers are doing a pi$$ poor job dealing with this particular problem.



TJR

 

[Gavin Allan]

My dealer refused to rotate my tires that I bought from him the last time I took the truck in for service (said they didn't need it), even though they have 17,000 miles on them. You can bet I am going to climb all over their case if/when they deny a claim for cupping or abnormal wear.

 

[William Washington]

My dealer refused to rotate my tires that I bought from him the last time I took the truck in for service (said they didn't need it), even though they have 17,000 miles on them. You can bet I am going to climb all over their case if/when they deny a claim for cupping or abnormal wear.

How odd, they do charge you to do that don't they. Stange of a service Dept. to turn down money.



Mine is always trying to sell me a rotation.

 

[Gavin Allan]

That's just it-- when you buy the tires from them, they will rotate for free for the life of the tires. However, they say that under the warranty you have to rotate them to be covered. I dropped it off and left it all day-- they fixed the other stuff but said my tires didn't need to be rotated. They even had two of them off.

 

[shawn stonbraker 2]

Wait, if you had it in before for a complaint that the tires were noisy, then they should have looked at the tires and the cupping should have been evedent and was probably overlooked. (even though the alignment was probably out then also and not looked at) This is the typical BS that these guys are taught in school. My first semester at a GM sponsored school, that was all they talked about. (how to rip people off) You do not go above and beyond what the good book tells you. Don't think on your own, just read what the shop manual tells you to look for and if it's not there then the problem doesn't exist. Charge the costomer and move on to the next. I'm an x-ray tech now, I did two semesters there before I couldn't stand it anymore. You should have heard how they taught us the ropes of doing a state inspection. It was real sweet. You could fail a car right off the lot if you knew what to look for. Sorry to hear that this happened to you. Not much else you can do though, except not take it back to that dealer again. There are good ones out there, but you will have to look for them.

 

[Doyle Ptak]

Wow, this turned ugly on me in a hurry!!!!!!!! Let me clarify a few of your coments / statements. Yes I did have the tires balanced and rotated when I took the trac in the first time before the 12/12000 mile warranty, I had aproxamately 5K miles on it in the first 12 months. At that time I had asked the service manager to aliagn the front end thinking that Fords (remember this is my first Ford truck) like Chevy's are spotwelded in a jig for front end aliagnment. I was told that Ford truck do not have that and the front end was fine. This was not documented on the service paperwork. That is where I was screwed. It was not written down so I have not a leg to stand on.

The tires have always been noisey and from looking at the tire from the side they looked fine. It was not until I got on my hands and knees and actually looked at the inside treads on the tire that I noticed the wear pattern. As soon as I saw the problem I called the dealer armed with the TSB that was mentioned in previous posts.

The trac is almost 2 yeqars old and onlt has 13K miles on it, I only drive it on weekends or road trips to see my daughters in college.

 

[shawn stonbraker 2]

Dptak, I don't think anyone was trying to really hammer you. They were just telling you in thier "not-so-subtile" way that you're scr*wed. Unfortunately, like you said, they slid the old "don't document it and it won't come back to bite you in the a**" trick. I had a feeling that was what you meant in the first posting. The service dept's love to do that. That is why I always stand right in front of them and read everything they give me to make sure the original problem was written down. Live and learn and like I said before, try to find another service dept. and see if they treat you any better. The one I took mine to the last time was our local one and they messed us around twice. (once with mine that I didn't buy there and once with my wife's Mountaineer that we bought there) I may have to go about 1 1/2 hours away for my next run at my warrenty, hopefully that won't be needed.

 

[Fudged Undies]

This was not documented on the service paperwork.

These are the key words for anyone who chooses to use a service dept (ford or otherwise) for service work. Don't take the easy route, get EVERYTHING documented. No different than you would do at work. May be too late at this point, but hopefully others can learn from your headache as I'm sure many have learned from from older members posting here.

 

[Richard L]

Spaceman Spiff speaks volumes about documentation.



If you go to a dealer because of a problem, don't let them talk you out of checking on your complaint. If they don't write it on the work order, they won't do the check and it won't be documented. Even if they say that tire noise is normal, or you don't need an alignment. Make them write on the work order that you want the tires and alignment checked.



Good shops will check your alignment and give you a ticket printed from the alignment machine before and after the alignment. If you alignment is not a problem, they only charge you about $20 for checking it.



Also remember that Dealers do not get paid as much money from the manufacturer to do warranty work. If they said your noisy tires were normal, it probably was never checked beyond a quick glimps at your tires since it is common for all terrain tires to be noisier.. At that time you did not notice the abnormal wear and neither did they, so you cannot claim that they should have noticed it?



...Rich

 

[Doyle Ptak]

Points well taken. It's all a business transaction and needs to be treated as such, with dotted I's and crossed T's. I know it won't happen again to me.

Thanks for the help and reality check!

 

[Mike Wilson]

As the "Radiological Technologist" and the "Fly in the Pudding" said, (sorry TJR, I take

back what I posted last night, after this insightful reply!), these are unfortunate issues

that you have to deal with, and what is taught in Automotive Technical Colleges/Schools

nowadays. Money, Money, Money!

ALWAYS get documentation , and in a timely manner, by the way, of ANY issues that

you have, with any vehicle, while under warranty!

Rule of Thumb, Number ONE : C.Y.O.A.! (Cover Your Own A$$)!!!