Ford Designs

[Thomas Rogers]

Surprisingly, Caymen, "good looks" aren't the primary thing that sells a vehicle. It took Detroit WAY too long to realize that. There was a time when a new grill, or added fins were exactly the types of "radical" changes Ford, Chevy and Dodge made, and it was those changes that they "sold" to the American consumer.



Now, many consumer's want something that is more than "metal deep" (play on the phrase "skin deep"). Many look at overall value, and that has been discounting many of the domestics for years.



Also, what looks "gorgeous" to you, looks hideous to someone else, and vice-versa. I don't think I would ever own a Scion, yet they sell. I think those new Toyotas with the white tops are pretty silly looking, but they sell. I personally hate the BIG GRILL, BUMPY FENDER look that seems to be "stylish" today in trucks, but it sells.



Looks are only skin deep, and very, very, very few people buy something that they see on the road, that strikes their eye, and they say "I want that because it looks sooooo good!"



No, people BUY what they are sold. They buy what is marketed successfully to them. They buy based on "zoom zoom" ads, and flashy commercials, and hype, and often they are influenced in that buying purchase without even knowing it.



That's why crap sells, and the BEST companies are the ones that are BEST at selling, even (and especially) at selling crap.



Now, with that all said...why did I buy an ST? Good question. I always thought the Explorers were very nice, but never seemed to be able to justify the price. The versatility seemed there, but for the price, with a young family, a mini-van made more sense. I gave up my GMC S-15 with jumper seats soon before our 2nd was born, and got a Chevy Blazer. But that was clearly a poor man's Explorer. Then, the timing was right. As the kids got older, a new "entry" can to be...the Sport Trac, and the first time I saw one, I was intriqued. It wasn't until 2004 that the timing was right to get a new vehicle, and 4-door pickups were what I was looking for, with the ST on the short list. It was versatility, price, and looks that made me buy the ST. Form, function and cost...plain and simple.



Ford catered to my life and lifestyle and did it better than most with that single vehicle.



TJR

 

[Tom Schindler]

Surprisingly, Caymen, "good looks" aren't the primary thing that sells a vehicle.

Ever worked in a car dealer? That is the first thing that sells a vehicle. People want to be excited when looking at a car.



The Taurus was selling likt hotcakes. Then Ford redesigned it. The sales hit the floor. Looks didn't matter? Yes they did.



While Honda and Toyota redesign the exterior every few years, Ford goes with a minor facelift, if even that, maybe once during a 10 year span.



Looks don't matter? The Scion Xa and Xb look like ass. The tC isn't bad looking.



I will say it is 100 times better looking then the Focus is.



The Focus looks the same now as it did when it first came out in the late 90's. Just about 10 years.



The Ranger design is now how old?





Tom

 

[WXMotorSports DecalsPartsAccs]

The Focus hasn't been in the top 10 list since 2001. However, the only other Ford "Car" models to be in the top 10 since 1999 was the Ford Tauras, Ford Contour and Ford Mustang.



The Escort made the list in 1999 and the Focus outsold it.



The best selling Ford has always been the F-Series Trucks.



Redesigned Mustang didn't make the list in 2005. Is that a failure?



The Explorer? That flop of a vehicle, has been ranked in the top 10 list.



And, stealing those Mazda designs? When was any Mazda in any top 10 list?

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Caymen,



I never said looks aren't important. I will qualify what I have said and say that "good looks aren't always the primary thing that sells a vehicle", as is proven by those cars that you mention that seel, and look like "ass".



I will agree that it is the LOOK that causes the instant attraction, but very few people CAN and do buy a vehicle on looks alone.



If they did, we would all buy the best looking vehicle in the showroom. Most can't do that. They simply can't afford it, or it isn't the right vehicle for them. The best looking vehicle in the Chevy showroom (for me) is always the latest Corvette. In the Ford showroom it's the GT. Neither can I afford, and neither is practical.



I have NEVER bought the best looking vehicle in a showroom. And I have to think that most never will.



I will also agree that Ford does need to reinvent the styling and update some older looking models, and that might help sales, but I tend to doubt it.



I will go on record re-iterating that form, function and price sell a vehicle, meaning that the vehicle has to satisfy the needs of the buyer, be within their budget, and appeal to them. Since many mfgrs have vehicles that target the needs of similar buyers, then it comes down to other factors, like cost, reliability, marketing, looks, etc.



TJR

 

[Tom Schindler]

SeattleSportTrac,



The Escort, Taurus, Ranger, F-150, and Explorer were in the top 10 sales in the early to late middle 90's. The Focus has NEVER had the sales numbers the Escort did.



I have driven a Focus SVT and it was a blast to drive. It handled great, stopped equally as well, and handled like a dream. The exterior looked nice, but IMO, not attractive.



The Explorer sales are dying. Toyota, Honda, and Nissan are selling more and more SUV's every year while Ford SUV sales are coming down.

Redesigned Mustang didn't make the list in 2005. Is that a failure?

Ford sells the Mustangs as fast a they build them. (Actually Mazda builds it)



Can the same be said about the Focus? How about the Explorer? When you close assembly plants because you are building more then you can sell, you know you have problems. Ford is closing plants that build vehicles that havent had a redesign in 10 years. What idiots are behind those decisions.



I don't buy anything else but Ford vehicles. I don't spend my money on Japanese imports. I want Ford to succeed more then just about everyone else here. I love Ford vehicles and I get frustrated at some of their decisions and wonder how someone can shut a plant down because lack of sales, but do nothing to increase sales. The Ranger desiogn is close to 15 years old? Are you freaking kidding me? 15 years and don't plan on updating it for another 3 or more years?



Are you serious Ford?





Tom

 

[Nelson Atwell]

Hey,



School buses have looked the same since I was in elementary school (35 years ago), and the B-52 bomber has been around since the 1950's. Why can't the Ranger hang on that long too? :lol:

 

[WXMotorSports DecalsPartsAccs]

Tom - check your stats...



The link is to the Top 20 Best Selling Cars in the US from 1999-2001



1999 Ford Escort 260,486 Units

2000 Ford Focus 286,166 Units

2001 Ford Focus 381,748 Units

 

[Bill V]

Nelson--you've already been in Europe too long, if you haven't yet seen the new look schoolbuses that are coming out the past couple years. Some of them look more like yellow Hummer limosines.



(or do I have that backwards--Maybe it's the yellow Hummer limosines that are looking like schoolbuses... )

 

[Nelson Atwell]

I saw a Hummer a couple of hours ago. If the owner is not an American, they paid WAY TOO MUCH for that vehicle! Easily over $100,000 the way vehicle prices are in Europe.



I guess I haven't seen any new ones yet. They all look like big yellow boxes with a stop sign on the side.

 

[Tom Schindler]

SST,



Check the years I said. Middle 90's.





Tom

 

[TomT]

The Interceptor doesn't do anything for me. Hope that's not what Ford's planning on lifting them out of the red. To me the Sport Trac was the last unique vehicle Ford's come up with in the last 10 years.

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Caymen asks:

I love Ford vehicles and I get frustrated at some of their decisions and wonder how someone can shut a plant down because lack of sales, but do nothing to increase sales.

I don't remember the exact Ross Perot quote, but someone asked him why he considered himself a great businessmen. He answered with something like:

If I were a farmer, I probably wouldn't have the farm that produces the most milk. But I would have the farm that spilled the least milk, or at least know how to stop spilling milk.

Ford's actions of late are clearly about stopping the spilling of the milk. Sure, they could invest more in research, in design, in marketing, in revamping lines to make new, better looking vehicles, but all of that is "INVESTING", and investing is all about the future.



Very few domestic, public companies that fall on hard times in this country ever come out of it. Instead, they all seem to start a long, slow spiral, as they try to make positive results, quarter by quarter for investors. And the BEST way when you are on the ropes to make things look good for the short term is to cut costs, downsize, sell off divisions and close plants. Clearly there is no long term future in that strategy.



They are doing exactly what most companies in their position do.



I'm not anti-corporation...but what we see in Ford and other companies is what we should expect to see for failing public companies. Few if ever recover. Going public is all about IPO, and continued growth quarter after quarter (ask Johnson & Johnson...a public SUCCESS). But once the growth stops, the market matures, and the company becomes stagnant, then they are DEAD IN THE WATER.



The KEY is to never get in the position that Ford is in. You must continue to grow, continue to diversify, like other giants have successfully done...like J&J as I have said, GE, IBM, etc.



TJR

 

[WXMotorSports DecalsPartsAccs]

The Escort, Taurus, Ranger, F-150, and Explorer were in the top 10 sales in the early to late middle 90's. The Focus has NEVER had the sales numbers the Escort did.

Actually, if you read your statement the only portion in the 90's was - The Escort, Taurus, Ranger, F-150, and Explorer were in the top 10 sales in the early to late middle 90's.



I was referring to your "NEVER" statement which can't be included in the 90s as the Focus came out in late 1999 as a 2000 model and was counted as a best seller in 2000 not 1999 or any other year in the 90s.

 

[Nelson Atwell]

If I remember correctly, GE and IBM have been in some rough spots too. Hopefully, Ford will pull out of this. However, this will take a major corporate shakeup at all levels. The decisions being made from the public perspective are doomed for failure.



They apparently suffer from "Group Speak", where the boss says, "Isn't this a great idea"? and all the lackeys say, "Yes sir. That is an awesome idea. Let's build it!", and the marketing guys scratch their heads and come up with another lame ad campaign to sell another lame car. And when no one buys them, they sell each unit at a loss, hoping that Ford Motor Credit can somehow make up the profit they didn't get on the sale by offering a 1.9% interest rate.



Some grade school math and Econ 101 lessons are in order for anyone making a decision in this company.

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Yes, Nelson, both GE and IBM have had it tough, but they have done one thing I haven't seen Ford do, and that is branch out and reinvent themselves.

 

[TrainTrac]

Ford sells the Mustangs as fast a they build them. (Actually Mazda builds it)

Does that mean that the Mustang is built by non-union, non UAW workers? Aren't most, if not all, of the Japanese manufacturer's plants in the U.S. non-union? If that's true, and the Mustang is the only money-making product Ford sells, what's that say about the UAW?

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Regarding "Ford sells the Mustangs as fast a they build them.", if that is true, can somone please explain why there have been the same 5 sitting on the local lot at my dealer for as many months?



TJR

 

[WXMotorSports DecalsPartsAccs]

TJR...LOL personal friend is a service manager at a large Ford Dealership in Seattle area. He tells me they are having a hard time moving the Mustangs now. When they first came out they sold well but not anymore. They have 22 Mustangs on the lot right now and are trying to push them to other dealerships to make room for models that do sell. Fusion and the F-Series trucks.

 

[Gavin Allan]

Lots of Mustangs on the lots around here.



TONS of Escapes and Tributes on the lots.



NO RAV4s or CRVs on the lots anywhere...

 

[Nelson Atwell]

Maybe that is why they decided not to make a Mustang Station Wagon.