the famous toyota recall......

[gary s]

since this comes up here and there, you may want to check this update.

ETCS confirmed not an issue by experts from our gov't.

put any spin you want on it but now i realize how much they were exploited.

 

[Robert Caffyn]

It basically said there was no electrical malfunctions of any kind? The only thing that was possible was the floor mats getting stuck behing the gas pedal and the possibility of a "slow return rate" of the gas pedal assembly. This is good news, but it also means, Toyota is still on the hook for possibly $10 billion in damages caused by these problems. This still leaves Toyota with a black eye and a loss of consumer trust. We'll have to wait and see where it goes from here. Bob

 

[EddieS'04]

Ok,, so nasa found no software problem. There was a revamp of the mechanical portion by toy. Why would they do this if there wasnt a problem.



I kind of take offense to the operator error comment. Some of those that crashed were seasoned drivers. I would bet they knew where there foot was. If even on any pedal.



My question is. Does nasa out source anything to toy or its affiliates? If so I still smell a cover up.

 

[Les]

I kind of take offense to the operator error comment. Some of those that crashed were seasoned drivers. I would bet they knew where there foot was. If even on any pedal.

Come on Eddie, how would NASA benefit from covering this up? This was operator error. Blame it on the floor mats or slow returning gas pedals, either way, putting the car into neutral or turning off the ignition would have prevented these accidents.

 

[scott degroot]

I don't think there is any cover up as they could have just let this slowly fade away without saying anything, I think most of the American public has forgotten about it now anyway. What does bother me is that the way they are saying it almost makes it sound as if there were nothing ever wrong. I truly believe that there was an issue, whether it be a sticky accelerator pedal or a floor mat incorrectly placed, but not once did I ever buy the software theory. With that being said I think some common sense on the vehicle operators side would have prevented the most serious incidents that we all heard about.

 

[EddieS'04]

how would NASA benefit from covering this up

Does nasa out source anything to toy or its affiliates? That was a question not an accusation. Might not be software. The finger got pointed at drivers again, odd.



After my asignments 2yrs in 'Nam. There are times, I have a mistrust in our govrnment and corporate affiliates. The Feds lied about things that will never be told. Also several civilian corporations involved with us. Do I believe in conspericy cover ups. You bet I do. You had to have been there.



What do some have to gain? More than you will ever know.

 

[Jerry Gerner 2]

Now does this "mechanical/operator/floormat" error rule out the Prius' "electrical" error for it's brakes not working? and how when the when the brakes are controlled/relayed by the computer. I believe some were because of floormats and driver error, not everyone knows how to react in a critical situation but not every single one. "Toyota " technology is put into all of things and yes NASA could benefit from this, their budget is nowhere near the amount it used to be, just saying. Cover up, maybe. We'll never know just like many things in history that "can't/ won't" ever be solved. Too much many and politics is invoked in this one to have the "complete" truth come out.

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Some of the incidents were caused by dual floor mats. I've done it myself, put a winter mat over the summer mats. And, it has caused issues with the clutch on my standard if the mats get pushed up too far. I suspect several of the incidents were related to the dual mats problem, others due to people with foot on gas when they thought it was on the brake.



Sure, a redesign of the mechanicals can help with a gas pedal that has a heftier, more forceful return.



However, I believe this report by NASA, and it aligns exactly with what I expected would be the finally results. Ultimately the operator is to blame, in the majority, and Toyota probably only in so much as they can redesign to allow for operator error to a greater degree.



As for several of the incidents dealing with seasoned drivers...well, anyone can panic and when that happens experience can fly out the window.



TJR

 

[Bill V]

So--does this mean that the guy who went to prison for causing a deadly accident, then went free because it was determined that the car (not the driver) may be the one at fault, now needs to go back to prison?

 

[Tom Schindler]

I blame it completely on operator error. How dumb must someone be to actually buy a Toyota with all that residule?





Tom

 

[Jerry Gerner 2]

If the "facts" found by NASA and Toyota are what they say they are then they would have to lock that guy back up. He can't stay free now that the "facts" and studies have found "no" computer error on Toyota's part , right.

 

[Richard L]

I dont think NASA or NHTSA had anthing to gain by exonerating Toyota for the Sudden Acceleration problem.



If they found nothing wrong with the cars then what else can it be but operator error, or a very rare, freak incident than is all but impossible to duplicate.



Perhaps it the floor mats, or someone accidently steping on the gas and the brake simultaneously. I have even had that happen with my 2003 Sport Trac when I wore a specific pair of shoes that had a very thick rubber sole. Without being able to feel the gas pedal, it made it appear that the brake were not working...very scary.



Perhaps it's the pedal spacing or the brake free play that allows the gas to be pushed to nearly full throttle before the brakes are activated.



Not saying that Toyota still does not have some problem, but it is very rare and only appears in some very rare circumstances.



...Rich

 

[gary s]

it is nice to know that the majority of our members can see the real world. :supercool:



btw: caymen, on the same day this news was announced, ford recalled the new 2011 explorer. i just wanted to let you know just in case your selective hearing was active.

also, when i told you about the recent ford windstar recall that you didn't know about, it was a benefit to one of your family members. i wanted to let you know about the new explorer recall just in case. glad i could be of help. :banana:

 

[Gavin Allan]

I blame it completely on operator error. How dumb must someone be to actually buy a Toyota with all that residule?

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

 

[doug brandin]

What is "residule:?

 

[H D]

It was probably a freak accident when my mother's Camry didn't deploy airbags and anti-lock brakes didn't work. The skid marks on the pavement and cracked windshield from her head were proof. Perhaps it was operator error? NASA didn't get involved, so I guess we'll never know. Either way, nobody in my family will ever own a Toyota again. When you have first hand experience with a bad vehicle, you don't need recalls, media reports, or NASA to tell you what you should buy. That's the real world I live in.



By the way, the Honda Accord she replaced it with was better in every way. Fit and finish, handling, looks, power, and most of all safety.

 

[Tom Schindler]

What is "residule:?

I don't know either, but Gary thinks it is awesome.



Hugh, I feel your pain.





Tom

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Hugh,



My next door neighbor was killed in a Honda Civic he was driving when he got hit by another car that crossed the line. Airbags never went off. My dad was in a GM conversion van, same story, no airbags deployed...killed.



Airbags don't always go off in accidents, regardless the car. More often than not the force and angle of the impact are the deciding factors on whether or not airbags go off.







Doug, Caymen,



The word you guys are looking for is: residual.



Residual is a value, linked to depreciation, that defines what a car is worth after a period of time, often used and calculated at the end of a lease period. Cars with higher residuals hold their value longer. In other words, they can be sold and traded in for a larger percentage of what they originally cost.



Most savy consumers absolutely want cars with high residuals, especially if they are thinking of getting rid of the car in 2, 3, or even 5 years. If, however, you are the type of person that keeps a car for 10 years or more, then residual isn't as big a deciding factor as some other factors might be.



TJR

 

[Les]

TJR, Caymen knows this, he's just poking Gary in the eye...

 

[H D]

I know it could happen in any make, but the experience with a Toyota is enough to make me not want one. Rational or not, I won't be buying a Toyota in my lifetime and I won't recommend anyone in my family buy one.



For the record, the accident was straight on from about 55mph. The front of the car went directly into the rear of a stopped car. The truck in front of my mother swerved between two dump trucks at the last minute to avoid the stopped vehicle and my mother had nowhere to go. The investigation determined she was going a safe speed and following at a safe distance, but the anti-lock brakes did not work, so she slid into the back of the stopped vehicle (all based on the skid marks). If direct front end collision is enough to total a Toyota, but not enough to set off the airbags, something is wrong with the engineering, IMO. Had the brakes worked properly, she probably would not have hit the other car or at most just bumped into it. She wouldn't have been taken to a hospital and the car would not have been totaled. So regardless of the airbag situation, the anti-lock brakes still failed and that is unacceptable in every circumstance.



My point being, Toyota had a chance to impress us (or at least meet expectations) and failed. We'll try other brands until they completely fail as the Camry did. Drive Toyota at your own risk. I'm just sharing my experience with Toyota. Gary and others may think they're the greatest company on earth; I just disagree. I base my preferences on experience rather than sales numbers and NASA reports and my experience with Toyota has not been pleasant. That is all.



Not to mention, Toyota just makes some ugly vehicles.:throwup::cheeky: