R 3
Active Member
sic
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For Those Who Don't Like Censorship
- Thread starter Nelson Atwell
- Start date
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R 3
Active Member
sic
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Nelson Atwell
Well-Known Member
R,
Just my opinion, but I think you take the criticism of Ford products (especially the ST) too personally.
I'm in the military. How many times a day do you think I hear people bad-mouth the President and the War in Iraq and Afghanistan? If I took all those people on, I'd come home every day beaten and exhausted. I'd be miserable.
Just my opinion, but I think you take the criticism of Ford products (especially the ST) too personally.
I'm in the military. How many times a day do you think I hear people bad-mouth the President and the War in Iraq and Afghanistan? If I took all those people on, I'd come home every day beaten and exhausted. I'd be miserable.
Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
R said:
Okay, so I will ask, without emotion or malice, what does a report on the testing of the F-Series mean for the ST?
You say Ford performs the same tests on the ST, putting the ST through the same paces and the ST fares as well. Where can we READ about that? Why can't we read about that? Why not take the skepticism that some are voicing here back to Ford and tell them:
"Guys, we are dropping the ball. We have a good story to tell here and it's not getting out!"
TJR
Okay, so I will ask, without emotion or malice, what does a report on the testing of the F-Series mean for the ST?
You say Ford performs the same tests on the ST, putting the ST through the same paces and the ST fares as well. Where can we READ about that? Why can't we read about that? Why not take the skepticism that some are voicing here back to Ford and tell them:
"Guys, we are dropping the ball. We have a good story to tell here and it's not getting out!"
TJR
Susan Pierce
Active Member
So much has been deleted or edited no way anyone could explain anything about anything from these threads. At least the launguage and spelling have improved....
R 3
Active Member
sic
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R 3
Active Member
Last edited by a moderator:
R 3
Active Member
sic
Last edited by a moderator:
Nelson Atwell
Well-Known Member
R,
Data, even when true isn't always popular. Check out the data at the link below. It is just data.
Data, even when true isn't always popular. Check out the data at the link below. It is just data.
Bill V
Well-Known Member
Not only isn't the article about Sport Tracs--but even if it was, and the article were to say that the Sport Trac passed the testing with flying colors, the question remains "So what?" Nowhere does the article say how any competitor vehicles did, or if they were even tested. So we really have no way of knowing what it means for a vehicle to have passed these tests.
Further, that article really didn't even contain any "data". It gives us a subjective summary of the tests, and then never tells us the results of the tests. The article was written from a marketing, not scientific, standpoint, and therefore doesn't hold much value to many people on this site who have demonstrated a fairly sound knowledge of scientific methods. If it provided some numeric information on how Ford vehicles did--even if they weren't STs--and how other competitors' vehicles did in comparison, then it might be something. But without that, the people on this site were correct to question this as fluff--and it is clear in reading the responses that they were questioning THE ARTICLE, not R himself--so he needs to stop taking everything so @#$%ing personally.
And I'm sorry, I can't let the article go without pointing out that the very first piece of numeric data in the article--THE DATE--is completely wrong. If the author can't even get that right, how can anything else be trusted?
Further, that article really didn't even contain any "data". It gives us a subjective summary of the tests, and then never tells us the results of the tests. The article was written from a marketing, not scientific, standpoint, and therefore doesn't hold much value to many people on this site who have demonstrated a fairly sound knowledge of scientific methods. If it provided some numeric information on how Ford vehicles did--even if they weren't STs--and how other competitors' vehicles did in comparison, then it might be something. But without that, the people on this site were correct to question this as fluff--and it is clear in reading the responses that they were questioning THE ARTICLE, not R himself--so he needs to stop taking everything so @#$%ing personally.
And I'm sorry, I can't let the article go without pointing out that the very first piece of numeric data in the article--THE DATE--is completely wrong. If the author can't even get that right, how can anything else be trusted?
Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
Did someone call you a liar R...actually use those words?
Look at it from a different perspective for a second:
Ford is stealth when it comes to the ST, and that has left a lot of people on this site very disappointed over the years. So you come in, say:
"Look over here! Isn't this great! What great test results. Yeah, I know, it says F-series, but we do the same test for the Trac with the same results...trust me!",
A reasonable person would then assume its a Ford employee spouting unverifiable test results and hearsay rather than Ford doing what they really should do, which is do real ST tests and publish them in a legit fashion. A logical person would assume that if the test results are so favorable that only a really, really stupid company wouldn't formally publish them. Getting 2nd hand information from an insider at Ford isn't a very good marketing campaign, and more than anything, Ford needs better marketing and better education, inside the company, then with the dealers then with the public when it comes to its products.
You seem to be frustrated as well with the message not getting out and that's why I assume you posted what you did. But don't expect people to not be skeptical and to not shoot the messenger when the message is delivered informally, inproperly and about 6 years too late.
I applaud you for trying...I would applaud you more if you took posts (like this one), drafted a formal memo and had it on the new CEO's desk Monday morning. Or would that be a CLM (career limiting move) within Ford?
TJR
Look at it from a different perspective for a second:
Ford is stealth when it comes to the ST, and that has left a lot of people on this site very disappointed over the years. So you come in, say:
"Look over here! Isn't this great! What great test results. Yeah, I know, it says F-series, but we do the same test for the Trac with the same results...trust me!",
A reasonable person would then assume its a Ford employee spouting unverifiable test results and hearsay rather than Ford doing what they really should do, which is do real ST tests and publish them in a legit fashion. A logical person would assume that if the test results are so favorable that only a really, really stupid company wouldn't formally publish them. Getting 2nd hand information from an insider at Ford isn't a very good marketing campaign, and more than anything, Ford needs better marketing and better education, inside the company, then with the dealers then with the public when it comes to its products.
You seem to be frustrated as well with the message not getting out and that's why I assume you posted what you did. But don't expect people to not be skeptical and to not shoot the messenger when the message is delivered informally, inproperly and about 6 years too late.
I applaud you for trying...I would applaud you more if you took posts (like this one), drafted a formal memo and had it on the new CEO's desk Monday morning. Or would that be a CLM (career limiting move) within Ford?
TJR
Gypsy me
Well-Known Member
I just want to say that When a few of us was at the proving grounds ...we never saw an ST tested....We only saw a Zebra 
ST's ARE tested the same as the F 150's and other trucks. but We never saw that... it was a Zebra I tell ya!
Edit: I did not know Todd Z was in AZ at the proving grounds here...
ST's ARE tested the same as the F 150's and other trucks. but We never saw that... it was a Zebra I tell ya! Edit: I did not know Todd Z was in AZ at the proving grounds here...
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JK II
Well-Known Member
I think Todd went to California not Arizona.
Nelson Atwell
Well-Known Member
I wonder where he is right now? He could clear up a few things.
Post 100...amazing.
Post 100...amazing.
Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
Yeah, Nelson, I seem to have the ability to kill a thread by posting a reasonable, "have you thought about it this way, and now that you have what do you think" type post!
TJR
TJR
I find it interesting tha 'R' has removed all of his or her replies to this posting. WOW, I'm no. 102.
Gypsy me
Well-Known Member
Yes ToddZ was in CA that I knew. and yes ST and F Serie trucks are tested the same way.
Rodger ha ha You are! and I'm 103!!! woohooo!!!
Rodger ha ha You are! and I'm 103!!! woohooo!!!
JK II
Well-Known Member
Now its just pointless. Rich should lock this thread and everyone should go outside for a while.
