Huckabee

[Thomas Rogers]

Richard,



Actually, I am no Huckabee supporter.



i support your opinion and even understand it. It sounds a lot like a litmus test for a president. I guess we all have them. I wouldn't support a stupid president, for example, or one that can't articulate his opinions. Some would say that would or should have ruled out GWB. Maybe...but in many cases we don't really know what we are going to get until we get it.



From what I have heard of Huckabee, and the other examples you gave just above, I would discount probably Baker, Swaggert, Falwell, Jackson and Baker. The Grahams and Huckabee would probably be as good for the job as BHO. Heck, Graham sr was counsel to many presidents during his time.



What dismisses those other guys for me is the simple fact that I think they are not that bright and seem to open their mouth before turning on their brain.



TJR

 

[H D]

Given an election between Obama and Huckabee, I vote Huckabee. He more closely resembles my worldview than the current President. That is all the necessary information.

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

Ok here is a direct transcript from a Tim Russert interview of Former Governor Huckabee. It took me 2 minutes to find this example. I was asked to find proof by Train Trac_ well here it is. Let me also say..before TJR, Hugh, Les etc...start making excuses and trying to spin this because they cant handle my truth... I ask (again) for all of you to take the thread, and what I say at face value. I dont mean to question your values. I ONLY mean to open your minds to a truth.



Oh one more thing...TJR you really should read "The Family" by Jeff Sharlet. It tells all the FACTS about the religious leaders who want to remake America into a reborn christian nation. You wont put it down. I would add that MOST of the GOP in some way associated with this group. ESPECIALLY the politicians from the south. Enjoy Mike Hickabees speech!!







Tim RUSSERT: I was reading a lot about you, an ordained Baptist minister.



GOV. HUCKABEE: Yes.



MR. RUSSERT: I want to ask you a couple things that you said earlier in your political career. Huckabee ... explained why he left pastoring for politics. I didnt get into politics because I thought government had a better answer. I got into politics because I knew government didnt have the real answers, that the real answers lie in accepting Jesus Christ into our lives. And then this: I hope we answer the alarm clock and take this nation back for Christ. Would you, as president, consider America a Christian nation and try to lead it asinto a situation as being a more Christian nation?



GOV. HUCKABEE: I dont think its dangerous to say that we are a nation that ought to be pushed into a Christian faith by its leaders. However, I make no apology for my faith. My faith explains me. It means that I believe that were all frail, it means that were all fragile, that all of us have faults, none of us are perfect, that all of us need redemption. We are a nation of faith. It doesnt necessarily have to be mine. But we are a nation that believes that faith is an important part of describing who we are, and our generosity, and our sense of optimism and hope. That does describe me.



MR. RUSSERT: But when you say...



GOV. HUCKABEE: Im appalled, Tim, when someone says, Tell me about your faith, and they say, Oh, my faith doesnt influence my public policy. Because when someone says that, its as if theyre saying, My faith isnt significant, its not authentic, its not so consequential that it affects me. Well, truthfully my faith does affect me. But it doesnt make me think Im better than someone, it makes me know that Im not as good as I really need to be.



MR. RUSSERT: But when you say take this nation back for Christ, what does that say to Jews, Muslims, agnostics, atheists? What...do you mean sir?? +







He then changes the subject of course. What possibly can you say to discount this? Of course Mike Huckabee is part of the "Family" that controlled American politics for much of the last 30 years. Dangerous ground to tread here. I now know why he dropped off the presidential landscape soon after this interview. No one wanted another man who said "God told me" to invade Iraq like Bush did.



It took me all of a minute to find an example people. I want to reiterate that I only want to "open" closed minds. Thanks for all of your posts. I truly enjoy them all. Keep em comin'



and P.S. HAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!



Yours in TRUTH



Frank

 

[H D]

An open mind would at least consider the idea that a Christian president advocating Christian values would be good for the country.



This is not open for debate! (pounds the "Frank Gavel")



In Christs Love,

Hugh

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

Hugh. Were you living under a rock the last 10 years?

 

[Bud Williams]

We are in the "Last Crusade" against Radical Muslim extremeists that want to kill all the infidels, spread Sharia Law over the planet, and basically take over the world. The terrorists love when American Liberals try to divide this country by either rewriting history, the Constitution or denying the fact that we have evil on this earth. The liberals are tools for the Communists, Socialists, Extreme Muslims and all other factions that hate America, whether they do this knowingly or not.

 

[Tom Schindler]

An open mind would at least consider the idea that a Christian president advocating Christian values would be good for the country.

Unfortuantly, this does not agree with the constitution where it says "All men are created equal...Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness."



Christian values says Gay people can not pursue happiness because they would be barred from getting married.



Keep religon out of government. If you are against abortion, don't have one. Don't like homosexuality, then don't be gay. Whatever you do, don't tell another man that is gay and is a tax paying individual that he is not allowed to be happy.





Tom

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Frank,



Hasn't Tim Russert been dead for like 3 years?



Also, not much of what Huckabee says in the transcript above scares me. I find it refreshing that at the time he supposedly said these things that he felt confident in his faith and skeptical of those that claim to have religious faith that say such faith wouldn't influence them, politically. I think anyone of real faith that claims otherwise is politically pandering, and that scares me more than someone who stands by conviction.



Lastly, I am skeptical,of the "I don't think it's..." transcript entry. That only makes sense, and the "However," in the next statement only makes sense if Huckabee actually said "I do think it's...". BTW, that is the only item in the entire transcript that gives me pause, and I am skeptical on it's correctness and context.



Frank, please post the source of this transcript.



TJR

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Caymen,



Not all Christians are so black and white and legalistic in their thinking that they wouldn't continue to support Roe v. Wade, or fight to support gay rights.



Not all Christians are what many think the stereotypical Christian Fundamentalist is.



Again, all we have to fear is fear itself.



TJR

 

[Tom Schindler]

Cayman

Who is this Cayman guy you keep talking to?

Not all Christians are so black and white and legalistic in their thinking that they wouldn't continue to support Roe v. Wade, or fight to support gay rights.

Not all wellfare reciepients are lazy. Not all black people talk with a ghetto accent. Not all people from the south backwards hill billies.



Point is that we do not wait until someone is in office that starts trying to enforce their Christian vales do we take a stand.



In the end, we have been so caught up in this whole me vs. you political mentality that we all forget one thing. We are all human beings and as this species, we need to look out for each other.





Tom

 

[Willie Anglin]

I Cor 14

38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

 

[TrainTrac]

Lastly, I am skeptical,of the "I don't think it's..." transcript entry.

Indeed. Frank claims to have posted a direct transcript of an interview without citing a source. So right away that demeans the credibility of the post. As I read it, it didn't seem to make sense, as if it wasn't the complete transcript, but rather "cherry-picked" portions taken entirely out of context from the complete interview and then posted on Moveon.org or some other web site that you frequently cut/paste from on here.



So I took Frank's advice, and did a quick search for myself. Lo and behold, I found the actual transcript from the interview to which he referred here: <A HREF="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22409176/ns/meet_the_press/">"Meet the Press" transcript for 30 December 2007 </A>



And in that interview, Huckabee responds to Russert's question about the "I hope we answer the alarm clock and take this nation back for Christ" statement, which you failed to post here.

it was a speech made to a Christian gathering, and, and certainly that would be appropriate to be said to a gathering of Southern Baptists.

Huckabee then further elaborates on his views of religion and gov't:

the key issue of real faith is that it never can be forced on someone. And never would I want to use the government institutions to impose mine or anybody else's faith or to restrict. I think the First Amendment, Tim, is explicitly clear. Government should be restricted, not faith, government. And government's restriction is on two fronts: one, it's not to prefer one faith over another; and the second, it's not to prohibit the practice of somebody's religion, period.

Frank, if you're allegedly all about "truth", then post the entire interview, not just cherry-picked portions that fit your point of view.



As for "The Family", and its supposed agenda, this sounds like the left-wing equivalent of the extreme right wing conspiracy theories about the Bilderbergers, CFR, and the Skulls, etc. wanting to establish a one-world gov't/New World Order. Have you contacted Alex Jones about this? Or Jesse Ventura? Maybe he could look into it for his "Conspiracy Theory" show on TruTV.:cheeky:

 

[Thomas Rogers]

Caymen said:

Who is this Cayman guy you keep talking to?

Sorry. That is your handle when automatically spell-corrected by the iPad to the more common spelling.



Yeah, I know. You don't like that spelling because it is too close to "Gayman", and back in the days when you frequented chatrooms you were always getting personal messages from guys wanting to get their virtual freak on with you.



As for your last comment. People should vote for who they want and people should be concerned that candidates will turn into crusaders if they become president.



However, I have very little time and tolerance for people that live in fear. I tend to not spend any of my energy worrying about what MIGHT BE. It frees me up to worry about and to change what ACTUALLY IS.



Case-in-point, I heard a lot of people say that they didn't want to see Obama become president because he would be an affirmative action (blacks rights) crusader. Wow!



Fears like that should a HUGE, HUGE misunderstanding of our presidency and the amount of power that one man has. It takes more than just the president to make things happen.



****, our country hasn't been able to enact any real change in over 60 or 70 years. Its just been decade after decade of increase bloat and increased ineffectiveness.



To think that one man can come in and wave a magic wand and change this country, is rather naive.



BHO can't seem to even be able to get healthcare reform to "stick", and that is something that many administrations have been trying to pass for decades.



Also, I agree with Hugh. An open-minded person would at least be open to the idea that a Christian president that tries to move our country [back] to more Christian values [could] be a good thing.



Again, that might scare some. But, I think the truly scared probably have a far different view and opinion of what "Christian values" means. To me, it's love and help thy neighbor as you would yourself...PERIOD. That could be the shortest Bible ever written. Not much else matters as much as that tidbit.



TJR

 

[Les]

He then changes the subject of course.

Frank, your attempt to spin needs some work. Once again, caught in a lie.

 

[H D]

:bwahaha:That's the reaction I expected.



"I have an open mind and as such these are the things that you should believe. It is not up for interpretation!" (Frank gavel!)

 

[Richard L]

TJR,

Not all Christians are so black and white and legalistic in their thinking that they wouldn't continue to support Roe v. Wade, or fight to support gay rights.



Not all Christians are what many think the stereotypical Christian Fundamentalist is.



Again, all we have to fear is fear itself.

Yes, I agree that not all Christians are so legalistic in their thinking, and they could be viable candidates for President...Most of our Presidents (if not all have been Christians of one denomination or another) As a Christian, I do not fear Christians any more than I do Muslims, Jews, or even Athiests But I do think we need to be cautious about those religious extremist, zealots, or fanatics being put into powerful positions where their religion becomes obsessive to others



Just look at the members of the Baptist church who protested the funeral of a soldier killed in Afghanistan. I think most Ameicans find that deplorable yet they do not have anything against the Baptist church or people who are Baptist or even Christians. But it just takes a few rouge pastors or extreme religious zealots and you can have a Christian holy war.



I don't think we can just assume that an extremely religious person would take the oath of office as President and just cast his religious beliefs to the side and accept that he is ruling a nation of many religions that perhaps contradict his religion.



We already have way too much polarization in our politics between the Democrates and Republicans. We certainly don't need to add Religious polarization to that mix. That's why I strongly support the Separation of Church and State. I would also like to see some law about Preaching Politics from the Pulpit. If politics is to be religiously neutral, then religion should be politically neutral as well.



Hugh

An open mind would at least consider the idea that a Christian president advocating Christian values would be good for the country.

I just scratched you off my list of viable candidates for public office...:grin:



...Rich

 

[H D]

Rich,

I didn't say I believe that. I said that if Frank wants to consider himself as having an open mind, he would entertain that thought. He won't; he doesn't have the open mind he thinks he has.



I hope you can put me back on your list. I'm going to need your vote.:grin:

 

[Bud Williams]

Frank, your attempt to spin needs some work. Once again, caught in a lie.

Tell a lie enough times, you think it was the truth!:bwahaha:

 

[Richard L]

Hugh,

OK, your back on my list. :grin:



...Rich

 

[Tom Schindler]

Sorry. That is your handle when automatically spell-corrected by the iPad to the more common spelling.

I am just jerking your chain.





Tom